Are you a PlayStation enthusiast first or a PlayStation business fan?
- Thread starter Jim Ryan
- Start date
What's interesting about the Sony business as opposed to other tech conglomerates?
Sony's customer service has been really good lately. It remind me of Nintendo in the Wii U days in 2014. I accidently registered my wii u on the wrong club Nintendo account to get points from it and when i contacted Nintendo asking if I could have it on my other club Nintendo they just gave me the Wii U points on both accounts and said no problem even when I told them they accidently left the points on my other account.
I just got a full refund for my PS Plus Premium One Year subscription I purchased 2 weeks ago with no questions asked but this might be because Sony is ending the Sony rewards program on December 31st of this year so they might not push back on anyone cancelling on that reason.
I'm a fan, but it's much harder to be a PlayStation fan these days when they're doing the complete opposite of what made PlayStation great. No communication, less games, losing key 3rd party partners, shortsighted gaas push, raising prices for no reason, more focus on PC than PS5/VR2, horrible studio acquisitions, and PS is objectively no longer "the best place to play". The only thing keeping me as a PS fan is that they have the best studios in the business and good physical game support.
It's hard to not be critical of their business when they're literally copying the Xbox's blueprint verbatim. Idk how some of the people here call Xbox trash for years but then applaud Sony when they do the EXACT same thing.
It's hard to not be critical of their business when they're literally copying the Xbox's blueprint verbatim. Idk how some of the people here call Xbox trash for years but then applaud Sony when they do the EXACT same thing.
Both.
I want Sony to have great revenue, get bigger, make more profits, etc. because if they don't, it will lead to even more layoffs, studio closures and less games. Can't have one without the other and as things get more expensive, they need to make more money. I don't care how they go about accomplishing this as long as I get games that I want to play and as long as they end up being great or better for me, I will be a very happy gamer.
I want Sony to have great revenue, get bigger, make more profits, etc. because if they don't, it will lead to even more layoffs, studio closures and less games. Can't have one without the other and as things get more expensive, they need to make more money. I don't care how they go about accomplishing this as long as I get games that I want to play and as long as they end up being great or better for me, I will be a very happy gamer.
Both! A healthy PlayStation financially is also good for gamers. But I wouldn't call myself a PlayStation enthusiast at all..I am a fan of games and PlayStation happen to be the brand that aligns with my gaming taste... But I don't play to call them out.
I’m half half with the criticisms you listed. Majority of what you listed makes no material difference to me as a PlayStation fan nor does it change the way I play games.
The reality of game dev these days is that everyone is pushing out less AAA games, but for me at least what they have pushed out have majority been bangers. Bungie was a headscratcher of an acquisition but they also bought the studio that made my fave PS game this gen, Housemarque. “Losing” 3rd old party partners is less of their fault than it is the partner’s who wants to push for multiplatform. Despite that, they’re still establishing new partnerships that’s already paying dividends with games like Stellar Blade and Ronin. No comms, eh, this one honestly is subjective I understand why people miss it but for me it doesn’t matter. I also dont see how PC is getting more focus than consoles either and feels like people don’t like PC getting ANY focus.
I kinda dislike talking about this sometimes because people (not you) often misconstrue this as blind fanboyism but if things don’t affect my enjoyment of a platform then I’m not gonna find issue with it just because people are upset with things.
THAT SAID. GaaS…fucking GaaS. This was the thing that really turned me off. Aside from generally not liking GaaS as a model, it’s also resulted in wasted efforts from one of my fav studios, ND, in just cancelling projects but all we got from them in the last 4 years was an unnecessary remake, PC ports and remasters (but hey new roguelike mode right
). This was the one business decision that I really hated from them and there’s just no defending it. I get the business need for sustainability but fuck me it sucks.There’s a stark difference between Xbox and PS. While we can see some overlap in strategy the way they handle their core gaming business couldn’t be further apart. Xbox is plagued by mismanagement and a general lack of care or understanding of what games is about. You can say what about Sony but they will never allow God of War to be treated the same way as Halo.
So yeah, I’m still happy with PS. Things are weird sure but the entire industry is just weird right now.
Fuck GaaS though lol
Everything I've mentioned has a huge direct impact on PS gamers, but if you don't care then that's fine.
How? AAA is a big focus for every publisher...but the barrier of entry for game development gets lower and lower every year, so more and more indie games have been getting some spotlight. Which kinda makes it seem like AAA isn't as big as it used to be, but it's even bigger. 2023 was a huge year for AAA gaming and 2024 is even better (imo).
I love Returnal as well and Housemarque, that was a great acquisition, their only good one this gen. That acquisition follows the blueprint of every other great acquisition, ND, Insomniac, Sucker Punch, Bluepoint, Guerilla, etc. Work with them for years, build great games, build a great relationship, then join the family. But that hasn't been the case with the rest of their recent acquisitions....
Haven - GAAS junk and acquired before any game has been released
Firewalk - GAAS junk and acquired before game has been released
Neon Koi - Mobile junk and acquired before any game has been released
Savage - Mobile junk and acquired before any game has been released
Bungie - GAAS junk and waste of 3.7 billion dollars, shortsighted knee jerk reaction to ABK, SIE resources being wasted on Xbox development.
Nixxes - beyond worthless for console owners and provides negative value to SIE
I disagree, it's 100% SIEs fault. It's not a coincidence that all of the 3rd party partnerships they've had for decades suddenly evaporated under Jim Ryan. It wasn't because of Xbox's aggressive bartering, it was because of pure incompetence, complacency, and greed from SIE leadership. Even MLB is a 3rd party game now
and I guarantee Horizon is next. If SIE had competent leadership and got FF9 Remake, Kingdom Hearts 4, and Metaphor ReFantazio as exclusives like they should have, then we would already have these games out by now. Like how we got FF7 Rebirth, the biggest and best game of the generation, after only 4 years and during a pandemic! But now these studios have to waste several extra years developing for the Potato Series S and PC, where they won't even make up 10% of sales. Sony has ALL the leverage this generation, more than they ever have, to secure 3rd party deals but the idiots just don't care to. Xbox is doing worse than it's ever done but somehow getting more than they ever have. It's nothing but gross incompetence. This is to be expected...3rd party exclusives like these have been a pillar of PlayStation since PS1. They shouldn't be commended for doing the bare minimum.
Plus, all of these 3rd party deals are coming from Shuhei Yoshida and have been in the works for 5+ years. Stellar Blade, Rise of the Ronin, Stray, Kena Bridge of Spirits, Phantom Blade 0, Lost Soul Aside, are literally all from Shuhei. Since Ryan/Hulst have taken over, we won't be getting anymore of these. Because now that Sony is putting all of their own games on other platforms, why would a 3rd party want to go with them exclusively? No foresight as always. It's a big reason why Switch 2 will destroy the PS5 for the next few years.
No comms sucks, but that's even not the main issue, it's when the rare times they do communicate, it's bad/useless news. Prices being raised, PC ports announced, gaas announced, apologizing to crybaby PC gamers, throwing their own devs under the bus, etc. Not to mention straight up lying to us. Hulst/Nishino said single player 1st party games will be timed exclusives, and then a week later announce a 1st party single player game day/date with PC/Switch. Every time they open their mouths they create a new FUD campaign, PS haters don't even need to bother coming up with new narratives because Sony does it to themselves.
Lol....
PC 1st party ports announced since 2021 - 14
PS5 1st party single player games announced since 2021 - One (Astro Bot)
PlayStation literally talks more about PC than they do about PlayStation, that isn't an exaggeration
They bent over backwards to cater to PC idiots with the Helldivers 2 situation and 1m sales on PC is considered a huge success while 5m sales on console isn't enough. The entire gaas push was because of their PC initiative since single player games flop on PC while gaas slop excels. PC is literally at the forefront of SIE's entire strategy around PlayStation this generation, even though it doesn't even make up 1% of their revenue. PC not getting any focus would be ideal, it's nothing but a distraction and a waste of resources. This gen would be 100x better if all resources were dedicated to the console....Yep, the overly aggressive and shortsighted GAAS push was one of the dumbest decisions in gaming business history. GAAS investment exploded overnight and overtook single player investment almost instantly, before they even had a proven system or any actual plans. All they saw was dollar signs and they leapt before looking like the idiots they are. They had the perfect strategy last generation, and they upended all of that to chase pennies. This is why I don't feel bad for saying I hope Concord flops, even before I saw how awful the game looksTHAT SAID. GaaS…fucking GaaS. This was the thing that really turned me off. Aside from generally not liking GaaS as a model, it’s also resulted in wasted efforts from one of my fav studios, ND, in just cancelling projects but all we got from them in the last 4 years was an unnecessary remake, PC ports and remasters (but hey new roguelike mode right
Not to mention how Naughty Dog altered their entire development pipeline to cater to PC and wrote a whole blogpost bragging about it. This was before they ever even launched a game on PC btw. And both of their PC ports thus far have been colossal flops. So now games are taking longer to make and are of inferior quality, which effects console owners, just to cater to a platform where they don't even make 1% of their revenue....That's why TLOU1 Remake somehow looks worse than TLOU2, despite it "being built from the ground up for PS5" (my ass). Another example of SIE leaping before they look, extremely incompetent leadership. This is the case for all of their other studios as well, Spider-Man 2 looks noticeably worse than Spider-Man 2018 and Miles Morales because it was simultaneously developed with PC in mind. That's why there was a fully functioning fan made PC port out only a few months after the console releaseit’s also resulted in wasted efforts from one of my fav studios, ND, in just cancelling projects but all we got from them in the last 4 years was an unnecessary remake, PC ports and remasters (but hey new roguelike mode right
Which just makes Nixxes look like an even worse acquisition. Except that their GAAS push isn't sustainable at all, half of them have been already been cancelled
Including Factions 2, which was 4 years and $200m down the toilet. 95% of GAAS games fail.... It's nothing but a trap. Every business/economics class teaches that during a gold rush, it's better to sell pickaxes than to mine for gold yourself. This gaas push is them trying to mine for gold, when they can just focus on increasing their install base and taking a 30% cut of the gaas games that are successful. You know, like what Apple and Google do and how they make just as much gaming revenue as Sony without even making games. And what worked for them so well last generation.....Getting people into your ecosystem and letting 3rd party's play the gaas lottery is 1000x more sustainable than making your own gaas. Instead they're doing the exact opposite, pushing people away from their ecosystem and flushing billions down the toilet chasing live service ghosts. Idiots Yes, and that's only because that idiot Phil has somehow been in high ranking leadership positions at Xbox for over 15 years, so Xbox has just been one awful year after another. Meanwhile the current SIE leadership has been able to coast off of the success of much more competent administrations. Everything good about PlayStation this generation isn't because of Ryan or Hulst, no matter how much some of these PS fanboys love to give them credit.
The only things that they've actually done since taking over is lose partnerships, raise prices, focus on PC, GAAS junk, mobile, and cloud. They have NOTHING to do with things like GoW Ragnarok, Spider-Man 2, Returnal, FF7 Rebirth, FF16, etc. Look at the last few state of plays and showcases, which have received an insane amount of dislikes, that never used to happen. Again, it's not a coincidence, current SIE is just Xbox 2.0 with better branding, the complete opposite of what PS fans want. No one tunes into a PlayStation event to see slop like Concord and Fairgame$ or to see PC be mentioned more than PlayStation. There hasn't been a single PS showcase/state of play this gen that could match the excitement of the worst show from last gen. I wish I was exaggerating.
No, the industry is only weird for PlayStation and Xbox, because both are run by idiots who don't understand or value what gaming is actually about. Both companies are run by people who hate gaming and only care about imaginary never ending growth by any means necessary. Every other company seems to be doing great, especially Nintendo. This year, PS5 console sales are on steep declines every month, even with great games constantly releasing, imagine next year when the Switch 2 releases
Well, at least they'll have GTA 6 to bail them out, but even that won't be enough. I hate to say it but the writing is on the wall, PlayStation is going full 3rd party just like Xbox 
Bigger fan of their console business than their software. Never cared for their first party until God of War 2016 outside of Gran Turismo and until they bought Bungie. Tsushima also… Can’t stand Naughty Dog games either. PlayStation has been historically dominant because of third party support. Still the case.
I'm a huge fan when it comes to PlayStation on its core, with the vision of Ken Kutaragi , Jack Tretton, Andrew House and cie. But not as much of this new prostitution version of the brand by those new CEOs pussies aka Hermen Hulst
Sony stands out from other tech conglomerates in several ways:
1. Diverse Portfolio: Unlike many tech giants, Sony has a diversified portfolio, spanning electronics (TVs, cameras), gaming (PlayStation), entertainment (Sony Pictures and Sony Music), and financial services.
2. Innovative Milestones:
- Walkman: Sony's Walkman revolutionized personal audio.
- PlayStation: The PlayStation series has set benchmarks in the gaming industry.
3. Entertainment Synergy: Sony’s integration of its gaming platform with its movie and music divisions creates unique cross-promotional opportunities, like movie tie-ins and exclusive game soundtracks.
4. Pioneering Technologies:
- Trinitron TV: Awarded an Emmy, significantly influencing TV design.
- Blu-ray Disc: Co-developed by Sony, it set the standard for HD video storage.
5. Global Footprint: Sony is a truly global brand, with strong influence in Japan, the U.S., and Europe, unlike some tech giants that are more regionally focused.
6. High-End Audio and Video: Sony is well-regarded for its high-quality, professional-grade audio and video equipment.
7. Financial Services: Sony’s involvement in financial services in Japan sets it apart from most tech companies which are predominantly focused on electronics and software.
Sony's blend of technology, entertainment, and innovative products makes its business model unique among tech conglomerates.
You should also add that Sony kind of sets the standard for movie production as they produce the (very expensive) reference monitors used by much of Hollywood to master film content due to their color accuracy. Sony does seem to be the kind of corp that cyberpunk dystopias are modeled after due to their broad reach, sort of like Samsung in Korea lol.
Hardware/Ecosystem... But they have to make business decisions which support them each, not support wider Sony or PC with nothing-back for PS.
At this point I'm mostly on ROG Ally for the portability aspect (natively, not remote play), Portal is like an encapsulation of their misteps, to me. Who releases that as the response to switch/switch2/Deck&Friends?
At this point I'm mostly on ROG Ally for the portability aspect (natively, not remote play), Portal is like an encapsulation of their misteps, to me. Who releases that as the response to switch/switch2/Deck&Friends?
It’s not that I don’t care, I just don’t think everything you listed as a major impact on me as a PS fan. But I’m not dismissing if they do have an impact on you or other people
I think I worded that incorrectly. I’m not saying publishers aren’t focusing on AAA, I mean that AAA game dev is is taking longer and longer and that’s without even getting into the ballooning costs to make these games. AAA output isn’t a uniquely Sony issue, these games are taking 4-5 maybe even more years to make, with increased costs and risk. 2023 was great sure but you look at something like Jedi Survivor and see that the previous game came out almost 4 years prior. Xbox is having a big blowout but those games were announced also 4+ years ago and some are only coming out in 2025.
Uhh I actually forgot about studios like Haven so I’ll concede on this point lol
I disagree, it's 100% SIEs fault. It's not a coincidence that all of the 3rd party partnerships they've had for decades suddenly evaporated under Jim Ryan. It wasn't because of Xbox's aggressive bartering, it was because of pure incompetence, complacency, and greed from SIE leadership. Even MLB is a 3rd party game now
So things like this I see gets brought up often but how exactly is it SIE’s fault? SE for example has been on shaky financial ground for some time save for XIV and mobile doing most of the heavy lifting. The next course of action they were likely to take was a multiplatform approach. What should SIE have done? In these cases we as PS gamers haven’t lost anything, we still get the games. SIE loses on exclusivity sure. Xbox isn’t getting more other than what? Marketing deals and a few days of timed exclusivity on Sega trailers? We can argue that Xbox gamers get SOME stuff on GP but if PS owners stopped buying games these publishers would probably end up going for PS+ deals too. So like I don’t know, I’m not on board with blaming PlayStation for this one because again, they haven’t suddenly stopped with partnership deals.
I’m not really commending them as much as I’m just stating that they’re still doing what they’ve always done and what they’ve done, the deals they’ve struck are paying off not just for them but me too, Stellar Blade is one of my fav games this year and maybe even on PS5 as a whole. Phantom Blade is in my top 5 most anticipated and I’m excited to start playing Ronin soon. I also don’t believe that these deals will stop because Ryan was around when they were signing deals in Korea and they’re still actively pursuing Korea and China, fostering Indian talent etc So I dunno, my personal read on things is that SE and Sega are kind of enveloping discussions around partnerships and I don’t think it’s that completely fair.
Yeah this I agree with. No comms isn’t a problem imo but yes, when they do communicate it’s horrible and you know, things like raising prices especially is also another thing that was bullshit. Games I can internally rationalise but the PS+ hike was so shit for the service they provide.
Lol....
PC 1st party ports announced since 2021 - 14
PS5 1st party single player games announced since 2021 - One (Astro Bot)
PlayStation literally talks more about PC than they do about PlayStation, that isn't an exaggeration
I mean we have to seperate announcements VS ACTUAL games, them announcing ports of years old games aren’t exactly focus shifting away from consoles. If PC really was the centre of PlayStation’s strategy we would be seeing day one launches on there. The reason PC is such a big focus is because it goes hand in hand with their GaaS push. Nothing has changed majorly with their strategy around SP games (though I will say Horizon LEGO does give me some pause on what they’re planning there but that’s more of a wait and see situation)
Yep, the overly aggressive and shortsighted GAAS push was one of the dumbest decisions in gaming business history. GAAS investment exploded overnight and overtook single player investment almost instantly, before they even had a proven system or any actual plans. All they saw was dollar signs and they leapt before looking like the idiots they are. They had the perfect strategy last generation, and they upended all of that to chase pennies. This is why I don't feel bad for saying I hope Concord flops, even before I saw how awful the game looks
Not to mention how Naughty Dog altered their entire development pipeline to cater to PC and wrote a whole blogpost bragging about it. This was before they ever even launched a game on PC btw. And both of their PC ports thus far have been colossal flops. So now games are taking longer to make and are of inferior quality, which effects console owners, just to cater to a platform where they don't even make 1% of their revenue....That's why TLOU1 Remake somehow looks worse than TLOU2, despite it "being built from the ground up for PS5" (my ass). Another example of SIE leaping before they look, extremely incompetent leadership. This is the case for all of their other studios as well, Spider-Man 2 looks noticeably worse than Spider-Man 2018 and Miles Morales because it was simultaneously developed with PC in mind. That's why there was a fully functioning fan made PC port out only a few months after the console release
Except that their GAAS push isn't sustainable at all, half of them have been already been cancelled
Oh fuck no I’m not saying it is sustainable, more that I know they said they’re investing in GaaS for sustainability. I don’t agree either and we’re already seeing them walk back this push for GaaS and it’s just insane to think what kind of setbacks this has cause for them. It’s the dumbest shit.
Yes, and that's only because that idiot Phil has somehow been in high ranking leadership positions at Xbox for over 15 years, so Xbox has just been one awful year after another. Meanwhile the current SIE leadership has been able to coast off of the success of much more competent administrations. Everything good about PlayStation this generation isn't because of Ryan or Hulst, no matter how much some of these PS fanboys love to give them credit.
The only things that they've actually done since taking over is lose partnerships, raise prices, focus on PC, GAAS junk, mobile, and cloud. They have NOTHING to do with things like GoW Ragnarok, Spider-Man 2, Returnal, FF7 Rebirth, FF16, etc. Look at the last few state of plays and showcases, which have received an insane amount of dislikes, that never used to happen. Again, it's not a coincidence, current SIE is just Xbox 2.0 with better branding, the complete opposite of what PS fans want. No one tunes into a PlayStation event to see slop like Concord and Fairgame$ or to see PC be mentioned more than PlayStation. There hasn't been a single PS showcase/state of play this gen that could match the excitement of the worst show from last gen. I wish I was exaggerating.
No, the industry is only weird for PlayStation and Xbox, because both are run by idiots who don't understand or value what gaming is actually about. Both companies are run by people who hate gaming and only care about imaginary never ending growth by any means necessary. Every other company seems to be doing great, especially Nintendo. This year, PS5 console sales are on steep declines every month, even with great games constantly releasing, imagine next year when the Switch 2 releases
lol I will say that I’m not trying to defend leadership on either side. I have my issues with SIE as well. But it’s hard to look at the entire industry and only pinpoint Sony tbh. I feel like the only big companies not affected by the industry madness is Capcom and Nintendo who seem to be doing their usual thing. But we’re seeing games literally sink studios left and right. Layoffs and declining sales everywhere. Shit is shaky as fuck.
But look, there is a lot to criticize Sony on and you reminded me of a lot of stuff actually like Haven and price increases. So yeah, I don’t think they’re in the gutter far from it tbh but I do understand some of your criticisms.
Also, thanks for taking the time to reply to each point
Appreciate you