What really is first party nowadays? Definition of first/second/third party games.

[SuperPotato]

First party = Platform holder owns the IP and develops the game in house.

Second party = Doesn't own the IP but has publishing rights or owns the IP but the game is developed by a third party studio.

Third party = Doesn't own the IP and isn't involved in the development.

The Last of Us = First party
Stellar Blade and Helldivers 2 = Second party
FF7 Rebirth = Third party

 

[Vertigo]

Helldivers is not second party. It’s only owned by Sony and developed by a third party dev. Arrowhead can sign an agreement with MS tomorrow.

Neither is stellar blade

Rare was a Nintendo second party when Nintendo owned close to 50% of the company. Microsoft bought them 100% and then they were an MS first party dev when releasing games on Xbox.

Rare is a third party dev for Sea of Thieves on PlayStation.

1st, 2nd and 3rd party is not meant to define exclusivity lmfao

 

[SuperPotato]

Helldivers is not second party. It’s only owned by Sony and developed by a third party dev. Arrowhead can sign an agreement with MS tomorrow.

Neither is stellar blade

The IP is first party but the game was developed by a independent studio. So, Helldivers 2 is a second party game. If Helldivers 3 gets developed in house it'll be completely first party.

Shift Up signed a second party deal with Sony.

 

[arvfab]

First party = Platform holder owns the IP and develops the game in house.

Second party = Doesn't own the IP but has publishing rights or owns the IP but the game is developed by a third party studio.

Third party = Doesn't own the IP and isn't involved in the development.

The Last of Us = First party
Stellar Blade and Helldivers 2 = Second party
FF7 Rebirth = Third party

Second party doesn't really exist. It's just commonly used to describe a 1st party title being developed by a non-proprietary studio. E.g. when Insomniac made R&C before being bought.

Stellar Blade is fully 3rd party, PlayStation doesn't own the IP (nor the dev).

 

[ethomaz]

The IP is first party but the game was developed by a independent studio. So, Helldivers 2 is a second party game. If Helldivers 3 gets developed in house it'll be completely first party.

Shift Up signed a second party deal with Sony.

Helldrivers 2 is a first party game developed by an external studio.

Most of first party games from PlayStation in the past were developed by 3rd-party (external) studios.

Journalist created the alias “second party” but it doesn’t change the fact it is still a first-party game.

 

[Ezekiel]

Video game developer - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

It doesn't specify publishing.

Video game developer - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Rare (company) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Rare was always touted as the definition of second party developer. if it's just publishing it would be first-party, following that logic. thus xbox bought a Nintendo first party studio?

Let's continue with publishing as first party, Minecraft is co-published by the platform holders, Nintendo for switch.

So Minecraft is first party for all the platform holders?

Octopath traveler was published by nintendo outside of Japan. Is that game a first party?

Octopath Traveler - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Mass effect was published by xbox, thus according to you first party. until they became a third-party ip.

So your definition is at odds with wikipedia definition. Doesn't matter which definition you'll use. Each game has it's own story with own deals and contracts, games fluidity go between different definitions through time. Making the terms and this discussion kinda pointless.

You're mixing up studio ownership with games being first party or not.

Ultimately it's all about the publisher and storefront. When both are the same, it's a first party game.

 

[SuperPotato]

Helldrivers 2 is a first party game developed by an external studio.

Most of first party games from PlayStation in the past were developed by 3rd-party (external) studios.

Journalist created the alias “second party” but it doesn’t change the fact it is still a first-party game.

Sure, if you only go by first and third party, then yes.

 

[Ezekiel]

Storefront/platform only determine the relation between platform holder and "seller". A PlayStation game is 3rd party for Steam users, but still a PlayStation 1st party title.

I think you are mixing both up, thous the clear confusion. Hope you will grasp it soon.



MS and PlayStation are going 3rd party because they are porting their 1st party titles elsewhere. They still remain THEIR 1st party titles elsewhere, regardless of where they are sold and if they are sold as 3rd party games there.

You're almost there.

A SIE published game on PSN is a first party game.

A SIE published game on Steam is a third party game.

 

[Ezekiel]

It has nothing to do with platforms or storefronts.

It is simply perspective. No different to First Person/Third Person.

We do this cause we have been trained look from Platform/Storefront holders perspective. So we consider Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft or even Valve as First Party.

So saying Microsoft is going Third Party is correct because they are releasing their First Party games on a Third Party Platform.

But it is no different to Square Enix releasing their First Party games on a Third Party Platform.

First Party = Me
Third Party = Someone else

It IS a matter of perspective, in relation to who the publisher is and what the storefront is.

If both are the same, it's a first party game.

MS is porting more of their games on PSN. All their games on PSN are third party games. They are exactly like any other game except those published by SIE.

 

[akira__]

You're mixing up studio ownership with games being first party or not.

Ultimately it's all about the publisher and storefront. When both are the same, it's a first party game.

Ah now I understand why this thread became so negative. You're not even engaging with the comment, and you're attacking too.

I'll make it simpler then.

If its just publishing we get these weird games: mass effect, octopath traveler. They are first party according to your definition.

And Minecraft being co published is first party of Playstation, Nintendo, and Xbox.

 

[Ezekiel]

Ah now I understand why this thread became so negative. You're not even engaging with the comment, and you're attacking too.

I'll make it simpler then.

If its publishing we get these weird games: mass effect, octopath traveler. They are first party according to you definition.

And Minecraft being co published is first party of Playstation, Nintendo, and Xbox.

"Not engaging with the comment"?

You put links for Wikipedia about "first/second/third party developers". It has nothing do to we first/third party games.

If I play Sea of Thieves on my PS5 Pro, it is in fact a third party game. We can talk about how the IP is owned by MS or how it is developed by a MS owned studio, it changes nothing about the status of the game where I play it.

All your other examples are clean cut too. If Nintendo publishes Minecraft on their storefront, that is, by definition, a first party game. It doesn't mean Nintendo owns the IP or owns the studio, but they provide it directly to their customers in way of publishing on their storefront. That direct selling structure is what is called "first party".

I fail to see where I "attacked" anyone here.

 

[arvfab]

Ah now I understand why this thread became so negative. You're not even engaging with the comment, and you're attacking too.

I'll make it simpler then.

If its just publishing we get these weird games: mass effect, octopath traveler. They are first party according to your definition.

And Minecraft being co published is first party of Playstation, Nintendo, and Xbox.

Even more crazy, Call of Duty is a PlayStation 1st party title in Japan

You're almost there.

I've lost any hope you getting there.

A SIE published game on PSN is a first party game.

A SIE published game on Steam is a third party game.

A SIE first party title is a SIE 1st party title.

 

[Hezekiah]

The opposite lol
You are saying something that is wrong with tons of examples going against you.
Even so you keep coming here trying to insult people.

Dude, I'm a gamedev since almost 20 years ago with many friends in many top companies, I'm in multiple game preservation groups and opened a gaming history related museum exhibition last week. I know what I'm talking about.

This is what I'm talking about - there's nothing worse than somebody who's clueless talking like they are a subject expert. On GAF you became a laughing stock exactly because of this.

 

[arvfab]

This is what I'm talking about - there's nothing worse than somebody who's clueless talking like they are a subject expert. On GAF you became a laughing stock exactly because of this.

You believe what Yurinka says?

 

[ethomaz]

You're almost there.

A SIE published game on PSN is a first party game.

A SIE published game on Steam is a third party game.

Not exactly.

Sony publishing a game on PSN can be either 1st-party or 3rd-party.
Depends if they own the game IP.

Like I showed as examples here:
Destruction Derby (published by Sony)
Ghostbuster (published by Sony in Europe)
Sunset Overdrive (published by Microsoft)
Stellar Blade (published by Sony)
Bayonetta 2 (published by Nintendo)
Bayonetta 3 (published by Nintendo)
etc

All 3rd-party games.

 

[ethomaz]

This is what I'm talking about - there's nothing worse than somebody who's clueless talking like they are a subject expert. On GAF you became a laughing stock exactly because of this.

Again... look at the fact... c'mon.
Stop the play the victim or acuse others.

There are several games that are 3rd-party and published by the platform owner.
I listed several of them.

But let's take just one.
Bayonetta 2.

IP ownership: Sega
Published by Nintendo = Nintendo has the publishing rights.
Exclusive to Nintendo = Nintendo have a contract deal with Sega that makes the game exclusive to Nintendo platforms.
Developed by Platinum = 3rd-party studio contracted to develop the game.

The game is a clear 3rd-party exclusive to Nintendo platforms.
But in your wrongly definition it is a 1st-party game.

Do you understand now?

 

[ethomaz]

The IP is first party but the game was developed by a independent studio. So, Helldivers 2 is a second party game. If Helldivers 3 gets developed in house it'll be completely first party.

Shift Up signed a second party deal with Sony.

Helldivers 2 is first-party no matter who develop it.
Over 90% of first-party games on PS1 were developed by 3rd-party studios... they continued being 1st-party.

Second-party is an sub category created by journalists to say a 1st-party games that where developed by a external studio (not owned by the platform holder).
Second-party itself doesn't exists.

In these cases...

Helldivers 2: first party (second party using the 90s journalists categorization)
Stellar Blade: third party.

 

[Hezekiah]

You believe what Yurinka says?

Much more than Ethomaz that's for sure

 

[Hezekiah]

Again... look at the fact... c'mon.
Stop the play the victim or acuse others.

There are several games that are 3rd-party and published by the platform owner.
I listed several of them.

But let's take just one.
Bayonetta 2.

IP ownership: Sega
Published by Nintendo = Nintendo has the publishing rights.
Exclusive to Nintendo = Nintendo have a contract deal with Sega that makes the game exclusive to Nintendo platforms.
Developed by Platinum = 3rd-party studio contracted to develop the game.

The game is a clear 3rd-party exclusive to Nintendo platforms.
But in your wrongly definition it is a 1st-party game.

Do you understand now?

No one's playing victim dummy. The SIE stuff was covered yesterday in depth, no idea why you're talking about Bayonetta. Stellar Blade, Helldivers etc are SIE published and considered first-party by Sony. I don't know how many times you can be told this, I'm guessing you enjoy getting mugged off.

 

[Ezekiel]

Not exactly.

Sony publishing a game on PSN can be either 1st-party or 3rd-party.
Depends if they own the game IP.

Like I showed as examples here:
Destruction Derby (published by Sony)
Ghostbuster (published by Sony in Europe)
Sunset Overdrive (published by Microsoft)
Stellar Blade (published by Sony)
Bayonetta 2 (published by Nintendo)
Bayonetta 3 (published by Nintendo)
etc

All 3rd-party games.

The games published by SIE on PSN are first party.

Many of the games you mention are first party when taken from the perspective of the storefront it's on.