this is why Cloud Gaming will never replace hardware and even MS knows it now (current Xbox Scenario)

Etifilio

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27 Jun 2023
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it's no news to anyone that gaming consumers don't like the idea of not owning their games (being digital or physical), let alone be attatched to a monthly fee to access them, now if you think this is not enough, imagine paying 70 dollars for a license to STREAM a game of your library + 160 - 200 dollars annually on a subscription to have access to datacenters to stream your game, you think consumers would do that? (coff coff Stadia, coff coff) it's either the Netflix model (day one releases on the subscription) or nothing, and even the Netflix model for games doesn't work, cause most consumers don't like to be locked to a subscription/fee to access game content, you see, and i'll use Xbox as an example...
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if you take the Xbox One base (50M) + the Xbox Series S/X base (25M) it results in 75 million Xbox consoles out there that can be potential GamePass subscribers, and MS just revealed that former Live Gold + GamePass subscribers reached a number of 34 million (on PC, Phones, Tablets, Smart TVs and Consoles), if not even half of the CONSOLE base for Xbox subscribes to GamePass, why do you think people that are outside of the console/hardcore space would? simple, they would not.
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Xbox has been putting their games on PC day and date since 2016, almost 10 years ago and a lot of people still refuse to subscribe to GamePass on the platform, most prefer to buy the game on Steam, own it and play it when they feel like they want to play, without a hurry of being on a monthly fee to access it or being afraid of the game leaving the catalog of the service, and actually most people play one game at a time, that's why the 'all you can eat' Netflix subscription model doesn't make sense for games, it makes sense for movies (2 hours) and tv shows (40 - 90 min per episode), but a game can take up to 100 hours to complete, it's better to buy it than to rent it for the core audience, specially the ones that work during the day and only have a few hours to play everyday, an adult that works every day can take more than 1 month to complete a game like Starfield for example, let alone hundreds of games, it just doesn't make sense
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the model Microsoft has been investing since 2017 when they launched GamePas is the wrong model, they realized that after their subscription numbers stagnated in 2022, many Xbox fanboys don't want you to know this, but Xbox GamePass actually lost subscribers post Covid Pandemic when people started to leave their homes again, MS had to rename Live Gold and call it GamePass Core and combine it with Console/PC and Ultimate memberships to boost subscribers and it still didn't meet their targets, after so many years of wrong decisions, only one could be made to save Xbox
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third party publisher: that's what the future of Xbox is, games on every platform TO SELL, Microsoft lost the opportunity of making the right decisions in the Xbox One generation and gaining a large player base, they could've kept the old strategy of selling great AAA games, putting them on subscription services after 2 - 3 years and porting games to PC only after 2 years like Sony is doing, but no, with Microsoft is always 100% or nothing, just like they bet everything on the Kinect, forcing consumers to buy it bundled with every Xbox One, to then just 2 years later discontinue the device and never mention it again, they had to put 100% of the efforts in GamePass and end Xbox as a viable hardware platform...
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the big reality here is that the vast majority of consumers subscribe to services like PS+, NS Online and GamePass to play games online, once this ridiculous barrier MS set in the 360 generation no longer exists, these subscriptions will all lose millions of subscribers cause people who care about their catalogs are the minority in the casual gaming space, you see, don't you think it's a little bit strange that Microsoft completed their acquisition of Activision Blizzard King half a year ago and they still didn't put these games on the gamepass catalog? with ballooning budgets, the GamePass model will get more than an unsustainable status, it won't be viable even to the richest company in the world and that's why subscriptions and cloud won't work for gaming, the model is not compatible with the desires of the vast majority of consumers (300M people on PS, Nintendo and a couple hundreds more on Steam)
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Etifilio

Etifilio

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resuming for people who don't want to read the thread: Cloud Gaming will be an additional feature to core/casual users that subscribe to the Premium/Ultimate tiers of these services to bring their libraries with them on other devices like a phone, but it won't replace the hardware cause the majority of consumers care about ownership when it comes to games
 
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Box

May contain Snake
6 Apr 2023
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they made the mistake thinking cloud gaming would take off like movie and music streaming, a movie is like 2 to 3 hours long while a game can be over 150 hours. Not only are video game cloud servers way more expensive but is is also way harder to stream them at a consistent 4k 60fps.

plus with Modern tech we can download large games in a few minutes anyway, whats even the point of streaming them?
 
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Jim Ryan

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Facts, it would collapse the industry. Not grow it.

If they went this route, there would be no way to sustain big and impressive AAA games anymore.
 
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Etifilio

Etifilio

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27 Jun 2023
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Facts, it would collapse the industry. Not grow it.

If they went this route, there would be no way to sustain big and impressive AAA games anymore.
not to mention datacenters are EXTREMELY expensive to build and replace every gen
 
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Etifilio

Etifilio

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27 Jun 2023
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they made the mistake thinking cloud gaming would take off like movie and music streaming, a movie is like 2 to 3 hours long while a game can be over 150 hours. Not only are video game cloud servers way more expensive but is is also way harder to stream them at a consistent 4k 60fps.

plus with Modern tech we can download large games in a few minutes anyway, whats even the point of streaming them?
will never happen for gaming, it'll exist as an addition, but never as a replacement
 

Box

May contain Snake
6 Apr 2023
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will never happen for gaming, it'll exist as an addition, but never as a replacement

If i can download a new game in minutes, why would i need to bother with cloud streaming and all the latency that comes with it?
 
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Etifilio

Etifilio

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If i can download a new game in minutes, why would i need to bother with cloud streaming and all the latency that comes with it?
if you can run the game natively on your phone, why would you play a cloud version with latency?
 
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Zzero

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9 Jan 2023
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I think you get cloud gaming confused with subscription services. Not saying cloud is the future or anything but they are different things.
 
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Etifilio

Etifilio

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I think you get cloud gaming confused with subscription services. Not saying cloud is the future or anything but they are different things.
you need a subscription service to access cloud gaming
 

mibu no ookami

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Zzero already said it but you're conflating streaming and subscription. They don't have to be the same at all.

You can totally separate cloud gaming and subscription models and it is something I think you may see Sony do in the future and it is something that Apple actually does.

They have their Apple TV subscription streaming service, but you can totally buy movies and TV from Apple and stream them without subscription.

Right now streaming is locked behind a subscription, but that doesn't mean it will be in the future. As Sony shifts more to PC, it'll be natural to allow people to buy games directly from PS to stream rather than them split their revenue with Valve.

Streaming will allow people who can't afford major gaming rigs to play premium games with as little upfront cost as possible, including not needing a subscription and that is the future of gaming and why streaming will probably replace hardware, which flies in the face of your thesis.

We're probably 15-20 years away from that happening, but it's almost certainly going to happen.

You also should realize that Gen Z has been conditioned to subscribe for content, so even if you tie subscriptions and streaming together, that could still be the future.

The more concerning element of all of this is what games might look like in 10 years given that Gen Z has 0 attention span.
 

mibu no ookami

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If i can download a new game in minutes, why would i need to bother with cloud streaming and all the latency that comes with it?

That's making the assumption that the iPhone will be able to keep up with the best quality gaming without significantly impacting battery life.

I don't know people who are playing long form games like death stranding or Re4 on their iPhone. The battery drain alone not to mention the less than ideal controls make it problematic.

Phones are better utilized as multimedia devices which short spurt gaming in between someone messaging you and you doom scrolling Instagram.
 

Zzero

Major Tom
9 Jan 2023
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you need a subscription service to access cloud gaming
You really don't. Not in the MS sense of subscribing to a library. There exist things like GeForceNow or however its capitalized that you pay for as a service seperate from the games on it.
 
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Etifilio

Etifilio

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You really don't. Not in the MS sense of subscribing to a library. There exist things like GeForceNow or however its capitalized that you pay for as a service seperate from the games on it.
you don't have unlimited access without a subscription on GeForce Now, you can literally play like 20 minutes and then you get disconnected
 

Zzero

Major Tom
9 Jan 2023
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you don't have unlimited access without a subscription on GeForce Now, you can literally play like 20 minutes and then you get disconnected
That isn't a game subscription, as far as I know you get no games with it. What you get is the ability to stream your own collection of purchased games. In that sense it has nothing to do with Microsoft's troublesome business model of selling you temporary access to certain, prechosen, games.
 
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Etifilio

Etifilio

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27 Jun 2023
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That isn't a game subscription, as far as I know you get no games with it. What you get is the ability to stream your own collection of purchased games. In that sense it has nothing to do with Microsoft's troublesome business model of selling you temporary access to certain, prechosen, games.
the problem is that you rely on a subscription service to be able to play games you own from start to finish
 

Zzero

Major Tom
9 Jan 2023
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the problem is that you rely on a subscription service to be able to play games you own from start to finish
Yeah, I already said I'm not arguing in favor of cloud gaming. I am saying that they aren't, by default, like Gamepass. Thats just one version of the idea and when op bases all of his criticisms of cloud on the fact that Gamepass can't make money while giving out "free" games then it misses the mark on whether cloud gaming itself can be successful.