Despite Helldivers 2 success, Sony misses PC revenue target by about 20%

Banana

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10 Jan 2023
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That's what we've been saying all along. The PC money is Destiny and Helldivers, the rest is a waste and they cut the legs on PS5 even more. Horrendous strategy.


They sold about 200,000 🤣

They could easily sell this to future PS5 customers and keep 100% of the profits but now that it's on PC it becomes "worthless" in the eyes of PS5 users so they don't buy it.
So PS5 owners don't actually like the games, they just like that they are exclusive?
 
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Yurinka

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Okay then. We can assume 8 million were sold by March 31st (which is realistic), 60/40 PC/PS5 at least, and 15% averaged cut to Valve. That's $163 million. $20 average in MTX per user is $96 million. $163 million + $96 million is $259 million.

Which still means Helldivers 2, a surprise breakout hit, account for well over half of their PC FY revenue target. And that all the new ports in FY '23, plus legacy sales of ports from years prior, plus Destiny 2...would have likely accounted for under $200 million in total revenue. So at least a $50 million drop compared to their FY '22 PC revenue.

To be specific, this is how Steam's revenue cut works:
  • First $10M made by the game: Steam gets 30%
  • Sales in the pportion where the game has made between $10M-50M: Steam gets 25%
  • Sales after the game has made over $50M: 20%
  • Maybe in some fantasy world, but not in reality and not in the numbers reported by Sony: 15%
But yes, to assume 8M units until March 31 and 60% of it being from PC (so 4.8M units) sounds realistic. For the experiment let's assume that refunded/chargeback copies already were removed from there, so it's a final 8M.

8M copies sold at $39.99 (price is different/mostly cheaper depending on the country and currency, but let's assume this price as average) this is $319.92M paid by users.

Let's be generous/optimistic and assuming that with Super Citizen Edition + first Warbond + IAP the game made an average of $5/user in addons. This is an extra $40M more.

$319.92M (game, ignoring cheaper pricings) + $40M (addons, too optimistic estimate) = $359.92M paid by users in PC until March 31 (too optimistic estimate)

From here let's calculate and remove Steam's cut:
  • First $10M (30% of 10M): $3M
  • From $10M to $50 (25% of $40M): $10M
  • Over $50M (20% of $319.92M): $63.98M
  • $359.92M - $63.98M - $10M - $3M = $282.94M
Again, this would be an unrealisticly high estimate. Removing from there a portion of the cheaper countries and also another one from maybe too optimistic addons estimate I assume what Sony got is something similar to the $259M you mentioned, or maybe even under it.

We don't know which portion of the $679.4M reported as "other software" is PC, we assume that something above estimated $450M, with $259M not being "a vast majority of it" as you said.

As reference, in FY22 (which unlike FY23 it had a Destiny 2 release) Sony made $250M in PC and 67,725 million yen (not sure back then, but today this is $437.17M. So in FY22 they did outside PS and PC $187.17M.

In FY23, without Destiny 2 release and with Lightfall according to people here (I'd bet there is no official source) underperforming, I'd say that if this is true their Xbox+Switch revenue for FY23 should be smaller than that.

Meaning, if true their PC FY23 revenue should be higher than $679.4M - $187.17M = $492.23M

In fact, now I remember that the $250M for PC in FY22 was counting Bungie only since the acquisition, but the "other software" counted the whole FY22. So their PC FY23 revenue should be even higher than this $492M.

By that logic, you have to either accept that it was non-PC platforms that contributed the majority of their multiplatform revenue
This wasn't the case at all in previous years, so it will be even less this one with Helldivers 2.

In FY22 counting Bungie only since acquisition the did $250M on PC (counting them since the start would have been higher, probably the $300M they estimated) and (counting Bungie for the whole FY, not only since acquisition) they did $187.17M in Xbox+Switch.

But that FY22 included a Destiny 2 release, and FY23 didn't have it (was delayed a few months to FY24).

The fact the performance of other PC games outside of Helldivers 2 wasn't even mentioned suggests those other games underperformed.
PC specific revenue isn't mentioned in their FY/quarters earnings announcement, which is what had yesterday. It's mentioned in their Business Segment Meeting (coming May 30th).

Apparently they'll achieve their $450M estimate and maybe outperfom it.

Destiny 2 was 45% off Bungie's own forecast
Source, please? Sounds like a totally made up number.
 
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arvfab

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Does anybody knows if "Others" also contains revenue from being the publisher of some 3rd party games in some regions? Like they did for a while for COD in Japan or some SE titles in Asia (without Japan).
 

Vertigo

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26 Jun 2022
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Keeping track of the Helldivers engagement meta game… this week so far has been devastating to the playerbase compared to where it was just last week.

Peak concurrent on steam has fallen below 88k and the declines seem steep.

Interesting since Helldivers is “live warfare.” Is there a seasonal cadence to new content planned? Like where do they go from here and is there a plan for player retention? It can’t just be warbonds right?

i can see them approaching this like Fortnite… massive sandbox changes and game scope … in directions not many can predict. It’ll be interesting to see what happens.
 
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AllBizness

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Keeping track of the Helldivers engagement meta game… this week so far has been devastating to the playerbase compared to where it was just last week.

Peak concurrent on steam has fallen below 88k and the declines seem steep.

Interesting since Helldivers is “live warfare.” Is there a seasonal cadence to new content planned? Like where do they go from here and is there a plan for player retention? It can’t just be warbonds right?

i can see them approaching this like Fortnite… massive sandbox changes and game scope … in directions not many can predict. It’ll be interesting to see what happens.
New cool strategems, vehicles for traverse and combat. The game is back in the top 10 and ahead of Sea of Thieves on PSN for what it's worth, legs will be longer on PS5 then PC.
 

CrackmanNL

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Not suprised, LoU remake underperformed on PC (and launched broken). Returnal was last year too right, I actually expected that to fare well with the PC crowd but that shamefully bombed.. and I havn't heard much bout the Rift Apart port outside of the SSD DF video.
Or any crazy numbers for HFW, yep consoles are in real trouble according to Steamgeeks.

And we know that Helldivers 2 success was unexpected so its performing even worse going with their expectations.
 

Yurinka

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Not suprised, LoU remake underperformed on PC (and launched broken). Returnal was last year too right, I actually expected that to fare well with the PC crowd but that shamefully bombed.. and I havn't heard much bout the Rift Apart port outside of the SSD DF video.
Or any crazy numbers for HFW, yep consoles are in real trouble according to Steamgeeks.

And we know that Helldivers 2 success was unexpected so its performing even worse going with their expectations.
They didn't underperform in PC, they outperformed their forecast even if The Final Shape wasn't released this FY23 as they though when did such forecast.

Their forecast for PC in this FY wasn't $900M, this is a lie: the real forecast was $450M instead.

Apparently they achieved over $500M in PC during FY23 (we still don't know their specific PC revenue for this FY until they reveal it at their Segment Business Meeting this May 30th, but we know in rival consoles + PC they did around $700M this FY23).
 
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Gods&Monsters

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So PS5 owners don't actually like the games, they just like that they are exclusive?
Yes that's exactly what I meant 🙄
Keeping track of the Helldivers engagement meta game… this week so far has been devastating to the playerbase compared to where it was just last week.

Peak concurrent on steam has fallen below 88k and the declines seem steep.

Interesting since Helldivers is “live warfare.” Is there a seasonal cadence to new content planned? Like where do they go from here and is there a plan for player retention? It can’t just be warbonds right?

i can see them approaching this like Fortnite… massive sandbox changes and game scope … in directions not many can predict. It’ll be interesting to see what happens.
What the hell is going on with Helldivers on Steam? It's down to 55k, going lower everyday. It will never recover from the PSN Link drama.
 
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Evilnemesis8

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Interesting since Helldivers is “live warfare.” Is there a seasonal cadence to new content planned? Like where do they go from here and is there a plan for player retention? It can’t just be warbonds right?

We have no idea what's the long term plan for the game, they haven't announced anything or have a roadmap of any kind.
Which is a problem in itself for obvious reasons.

What the hell is going on with Helldivers on Steam? It's down to 55k, going lower everyday. It will never recover from the PSN Link drama.

That's how that works for GaaS games without constant meaty updates.
The PSN drama barely did anything, it's just on a normal decline path.

We can see this if you check SteamDB 6M option to zoom out the CCU curve.
Heck, if we take a look at it with 1 month selected, we can see that the dropoff has been pretty soft post the weekend drama.

Thursday May 9th to Sunday May 12th actually saw similar numbers to the week before(that was the drama weekend).
Why is that? It was simply due to Thursday update + Warbond.
It's clear people will show up, but doing the same old stuff is not going to cut it. But right now there is nothing planned.
 
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Vertigo

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Yes that's exactly what I meant 🙄

What the hell is going on with Helldivers on Steam? It's down to 55k, going lower everyday. It will never recover from the PSN Link drama.

Peaked at 80k today. The decline is drastic right now.

Post launch hype you want to see where it’s bottom line is with hardcore player retention and numbers like this wouldn’t be so outrageous.

But this decline is steep from the last week. Not ready to sound the alarm yet but it’s looking … dunno.

It’s also sorta unrealistic for something big to drop to get it going again so soon… the game was a surprise hit and I doubt they had rhe dev bandwidth ready to follow it up with what could it be needed. Hopefully by next year.
 
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Evilnemesis8

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But this decline is steep from the last week. Not ready to sound the alarm yet but it’s looking … dunno.

The decline has been pronounced for quite a few weeks, probably like a month(besides the drama week).

If we look at the week before the drama...


Sunday April 28: 166,305
Monday April 29: 139,650

26,655 drop


Sunday May 12: 119,702
Monday May 13: 95,493

24,209 drop


We're in May, so the amount of new players buying the game compared to previous months is going to be much smaller and long time players will be playing something else.
 

mibu no ookami

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We have no idea what's the long term plan for the game, they haven't announced anything or have a roadmap of any kind.
Which is a problem in itself for obvious reasons.



That's how that works for GaaS games without constant meaty updates.
The PSN drama barely did anything, it's just on a normal decline path.

We can see this if you check SteamDB 6M option to zoom out the CCU curve.
Heck, if we take a look at it with 1 month selected, we can see that the dropoff has been pretty soft post the weekend drama.

Thursday May 9th to Sunday May 12th actually saw similar numbers to the week before(that was the drama weekend).
Why is that? It was simply due to Thursday update + Warbond.
It's clear people will show up, but doing the same old stuff is not going to cut it. But right now there is nothing planned.

I've noticed the type of posters that like to overreact to everything and usually bring an agenda with them. It's still pretty consistently one of the top selling games on Steam.

It's doing really well for this type of game and not being F2P. It'll go on sale and it'll get a big boost of players. It'll get some roadmap upgrades and it'll get a big boost of players. It'll get a Starship troopers crossover and it'll get a big boost of players. Sony will probably make a Helldivers movie and it'll get a big boost of players.

And eventually the game will go F2P... and once again... it'll get a big boost of players.

A large amount of new games just came out that people are playing. Fallout 4, Stardew Valley update, Apex Legends™: Upheaval, Ghost of tsushima just came out, V Rising came out recently and is discounted already.

Crazy that anyone would try to measure Helldivers 2's sustainability in a matter of days/weeks.
 
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Dr Bass

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Despite how the topic title is framing this, I feel like the story the numbers are actually telling is that PS games on PC ain't going anywhere. It's here to stay, like it or not.
 
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Yurinka

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Keeping track of the Helldivers engagement meta game… this week so far has been devastating to the playerbase compared to where it was just last week.

Peak concurrent on steam has fallen below 88k and the declines seem steep.

Interesting since Helldivers is “live warfare.” Is there a seasonal cadence to new content planned? Like where do they go from here and is there a plan for player retention? It can’t just be warbonds right?

i can see them approaching this like Fortnite… massive sandbox changes and game scope … in directions not many can predict. It’ll be interesting to see what happens.
They keep adding new features and mechanics in addition to the warbonds, like new stratagems, mission types, vehicles (there are a few more coming soon) and also soon there will be a third enemy faction.

Helldivers 2 has a great retention btw, it will have a long life.