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EDMIX

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True but those who like/enjoy Persona 5 may not want to wait until if/when Persona 6 goes on Game Pass. Before they can sell Persona 6, they have to build an audience and charging $60 for a 5+ year old game isn't going to accomplish that but a sequel day one where the majority liked Persona 5, that's definitely doable. Whether or not it happens though remains to be seen.

I mean...I want you to consider they waited years to avoid buying it at all. Its feasible that you see Persona 6 if it even comes to XB, sell massively less based on people just waiting for some free, gamepass type thing. Will some buy it day 1 and be fans? Sure, how many of those gamers will actually fill that void though?

So the fact that Octopath Traveler 2 is literally not coming to XB, shows maybe that whole "they have to build an audience" thing isn't enough for Square.
Think about it, for Square to make money on PS and Nintendo, they don't fucking need to give their biggest titles for free for some audience to maybe, possibly, think about buying it in the future.

So maybe we are already getting an answer to how many really want to do this long term. I think some it may have really helped, but I think some publishers don't feel its worth it. So if you have to have the game free for them to think about it, is it even worth it to port a title to this fucking platform at this point? Those same titles move MILLIONS else where, but shit we need to give it for free to get some other platform to believe its a good game? lol Maybe they just don't like those types of games.

So it remains to be seen how this will play out for lots of publishers, but anyone that is a massive fan of Persona likely also wouldn't be out here waiting years for a free copy of it.
 
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Dr Bass

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Also, dollar sales is a dumb metric. The hardware is a means to support software. Unit sales and potential audience are what matters, not how much money consumers spent getting that hardware.
 
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peter42O

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I mean...I want you to consider they waited years to avoid buying it at all. Its feasible that you see Persona 6 if it even comes to XB, sell massively less based on people just waiting for some free, gamepass type thing. Will some buy it day 1 and be fans? Sure, how many of those gamers will actually fill that void though?

So the fact that Octopath Traveler 2 is literally not coming to XB, shows maybe that whole "they have to build an audience" thing isn't enough for Square.
Think about it, for Square to make money on PS and Nintendo, they don't fucking need to give their biggest titles for free for some audience to maybe, possibly, think about buying it in the future.

So maybe we are already getting an answer to how many really want to do this long term. I think some it may have really helped, but I think some publishers don't feel its worth it. So if you have to have the game free for them to think about it, is it even worth it to port a title to this fucking platform at this point? Those same titles move MILLIONS else where, but shit we need to give it for free to get some other platform to believe its a good game? lol Maybe they just don't like those types of games.

So it remains to be seen how this will play out for lots of publishers, but anyone that is a massive fan of Persona likely also wouldn't be out here waiting years for a free copy of it.

Persona 6 selling day one all remains to be seen but the answer can't be known unless it releases day one on Xbox. I think that it would sell between 1-2m copies.

Square Enix doesn't know what they're doing. Xbox doesn't get Octopath Traveler 2 but PlayStation didn't get the first game. Yet Switch gets both. That in of itself kinda tells you that Square Enix doesn't have a clue. SMH.

Sega didn't give Persona 5 for free to Xbox. They received what im sure is a pretty good payday for a Game Pass deal and chances are, they probably paid for the port as well so really, Sega and Atlus lose nothing but can gain a lot by expanding the potential fan base for the series especially when they barely passed 7m and needed two Persona versions and two spinoffs to do so.

Getting Persona 5, Yakuza and other Japanese games on Xbox isn't for the present, it's for the future in regards of getting new future releases in Japanese franchises day one on Xbox. Are they going to sell 10m+ or so on Xbox? Of course not but they don't sell that on PlayStation either so it doesn't matter. Getting new consumers and fans into these games on Xbox has already been proven to be working and will only increase as long as they get these types of games day one on Xbox. The new future releases don't need to be on Game Pass day one but the older games like Persona 5 definitely do because just like PlayStation fans didn't buy Rise of the Tomb Raider on PS4 a year after it released on XBO, Xbox fans are not going to buy 5+ year old games for $60. That's just not going to happen.

Hardcore fans of Persona most likely wouldn't wait but that's not the point of the Xbox port. It's to get NEW consumers who aren't into PlayStation or care about it because guess what, there are tens of millions of consumers/gamers that don't actually care whatsoever about PlayStation and only own an Xbox so if they want to play these games, Microsoft needs to ensure that they get them day one. No one is going to spend $500+ on a PS5 console just to play a niche game like Persona 5 and yes, it's definitely niche. Getting these older games may be a joke to PlayStation fans but for Xbox fans, they're brand new games that franchise wise, are releasing for the very first time on their preferred platform and it's a positive sign because it shows Xbox fans (including myself) that they're serious about getting future games on Xbox day one but can't accomplish any of that if they don't get the older games first so Xbox fans can familiarize themselves with these franchises and even if they get only half of those who played Persona 5 to buy Persona 6 day one or close to it, then again, that will be a massive success and another step in the right direction.

Plus, it works. Knowing im getting Yakuza Gaiden with Kiryu day one on my Series X is huge because I can actually play it where I prefer to play my multi-platform games instead of playing it on PlayStation 5 which for me, is my secondary console.
 
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That's wild in a way considering PS5 supply in NA seemingly only really improved mid-Summer, and I think prior to September (or maybe August?), Series was outselling PS5 in units sold in NA (I could be misremembering though).

Kind of goes to show how low (compared to recent months) the total number of units moved in the early months of the year actually were.

True but those who like/enjoy Persona 5 may not want to wait until if/when Persona 6 goes on Game Pass. Before they can sell Persona 6, they have to build an audience and charging $60 for a 5+ year old game isn't going to accomplish that but a sequel day one where the majority liked Persona 5, that's definitely doable. Whether or not it happens though remains to be seen.

If Persona 6 comes to Xbox Day 1, it will not be through GamePass, so the game will have to pull by sales to make it justified. Soul Hackers 2 may've underperformed in general, but it REALLY underperformed on Xbox in particular. That's not a great sign insofar as whether Sega/Atlus will prioritize Xbox as a platform to build out a version of Persona 6 for on Day 1 (as that will split the optimization pipeline, affecting other platforms).

But hey I guess we will see what happens. All that said, I won't be surprised if P6 comes to Xbox a while after down the road. The audience for this franchise is heavily on PlayStation, it's been that way since the mid '90s. If a fan really wants in on the new entry, they know which console that's a guarantee on. Similar to Final Fantasy games, in a sense.
 
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ethomaz

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That's wild in a way considering PS5 supply in NA seemingly only really improved mid-Summer, and I think prior to September (or maybe August?), Series was outselling PS5 in units sold in NA (I could be misremembering though).

Kind of goes to show how low (compared to recent months) the total number of units moved in the early months of the year actually were.
You are right… Series outsold PS5 the last three quarters up to June 2022 (that means since October 2021)

But the difference was probably very small because Series couldn’t surpass PS5 lifetime sales and with just September + October PS5 is already ahead Series in 2022.
 
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peter42O

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If Persona 6 comes to Xbox Day 1, it will not be through GamePass, so the game will have to pull by sales to make it justified. Soul Hackers 2 may've underperformed in general, but it REALLY underperformed on Xbox in particular. That's not a great sign insofar as whether Sega/Atlus will prioritize Xbox as a platform to build out a version of Persona 6 for on Day 1 (as that will split the optimization pipeline, affecting other platforms).

But hey I guess we will see what happens. All that said, I won't be surprised if P6 comes to Xbox a while after down the road. The audience for this franchise is heavily on PlayStation, it's been that way since the mid '90s. If a fan really wants in on the new entry, they know which console that's a guarantee on. Similar to Final Fantasy games, in a sense.

Soul Hackers 2 had a 25 year gap since the first game which was obviously never on Xbox. Huge difference between this game and Persona/Yakuza. Get the older games first, put them in Game Pass and see if the franchise/series grows and thus far, it seems like both have. Persona 6 would probably be PS5/XS/PC only and having it on Xbox day one shouldn't affect optimization or other platforms. That's just bullshit unless they rush it out which would be completely on them.

We'll see how it goes.
 
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Soul Hackers 2 had a 25 year gap since the first game which was obviously never on Xbox. Huge difference between this game and Persona/Yakuza. Get the older games first, put them in Game Pass and see if the franchise/series grows and thus far, it seems like both have. Persona 6 would probably be PS5/XS/PC only and having it on Xbox day one shouldn't affect optimization or other platforms. That's just bullshit unless they rush it out which would be completely on them.

We'll see how it goes.

I'd like to believe that, but whether Persona 6 is on Xbox Day 1 or not really comes down to how long the game has been in development versus whenever Sega/Atlus came to a conclusion that maybe moving the Xbox audience up in priority would be financially worth it. Because P5 was released in 2017, and I doubt the team waited until the start of this gen before beginning development on Persona 6.

As such it's quite possible that Sony may have locked down Persona 6 early on in the generation, even before the new systems released, as at least some timed console exclusive. Or just as likely, Atlus were developing Persona 6 before the gen launched but probably had no Xbox version in development. If there is an Xbox version in development, it would have only likely began within the year, and I think the common consensus is that Persona 6 will be releasing in 2023.

So considering that possibility, if we do get an Xbox version Day 1, it will mean that during the late phase of Persona 6 development which, similar to other games, is spent optimizing and polishing the experience before going gold and readying for release, that part will have been segmented some in order to ramp up priority for building and optimizing a build of the game for both Series X and Series S. Meaning the total resource allocation for optimization and end-development polish of the game on PlayStation 5 and/or PC platforms would have been trimmed so that some of those resources could go towards making and optimizing a build for Series X and S.

The main reason I believe that could end up being the case is because I find it very hard to believe Persona 6 development would have only began this year (which is the first year in which Sega/Atlus would even have user statistics for the Persona games on Xbox platforms to utilize in determining if it were financially viable to prioritize an Xbox build for a new Persona game in the first place), meaning Persona 6 development would have began years ago, when I strongly doubt Xbox was even a platform for consideration as the game was going into pre-production and then full production.

So a sudden timeline where we get a Xbox Series X & S version of Persona 6, Day 1 with PS5 and PC (and it might be a reach to say that even PC is getting it Day 1), considering the impact in development the game would have had anyway due to the COVID lockdowns through 2020 and most of 2021 (slowing development on whatever builds were currently in work at the time), very likely would mean end-polish and optimization resources for the PS5 and/or PC versions would have been divested towards hurriedly building a Series X/S version of the game and optimizing that. Considering, of course, that Persona 6 is coming in 2023, which seems quite likely as Sega/Atlus need something big for 2023 and it's not going to be another Sonic game, or Yakuza Ishin which is mainly a next-gen port of a PS3 game.

Something will have to fill that spot and Persona 6 is most likely to be the game. And I'm leaning on that being a PS5 launch exclusive most likely, with maybe a PC version within 6-12 months (similar to FF XVI), if there isn't one Day 1. I can't realistically see a Series X or S version of Persona 6 coming in 2023, but I can see one happening in 2024, a year after release. But this is all assuming Atlus haven't spent the last few months upwards a year or so rushing to do a Series X & S build for the game, though it wouldn't be the first time Sega's demanded such sudden dev shifts that'd have cascading effects on versions of the games already deep into development. We saw it sadly happen with Sonic '06 a long time ago.

You are right… Series outsold PS5 the last three quarters up to June 2022 (that means since October 2021)

But the difference was probably very small because Series couldn’t surpass PS5 lifetime sales and with just September + October PS5 is already ahead Series in 2022.

Yeah, they probably had a net difference within some margin of error over PS5 systems in those months where they led. Console sales in general tend to be lower in those months anyway outside of tax returns month, IIRC.
 
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peter42O

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I'd like to believe that, but whether Persona 6 is on Xbox Day 1 or not really comes down to how long the game has been in development versus whenever Sega/Atlus came to a conclusion that maybe moving the Xbox audience up in priority would be financially worth it. Because P5 was released in 2017, and I doubt the team waited until the start of this gen before beginning development on Persona 6.

As such it's quite possible that Sony may have locked down Persona 6 early on in the generation, even before the new systems released, as at least some timed console exclusive. Or just as likely, Atlus were developing Persona 6 before the gen launched but probably had no Xbox version in development. If there is an Xbox version in development, it would have only likely began within the year, and I think the common consensus is that Persona 6 will be releasing in 2023.

So considering that possibility, if we do get an Xbox version Day 1, it will mean that during the late phase of Persona 6 development which, similar to other games, is spent optimizing and polishing the experience before going gold and readying for release, that part will have been segmented some in order to ramp up priority for building and optimizing a build of the game for both Series X and Series S. Meaning the total resource allocation for optimization and end-development polish of the game on PlayStation 5 and/or PC platforms would have been trimmed so that some of those resources could go towards making and optimizing a build for Series X and S.

The main reason I believe that could end up being the case is because I find it very hard to believe Persona 6 development would have only began this year (which is the first year in which Sega/Atlus would even have user statistics for the Persona games on Xbox platforms to utilize in determining if it were financially viable to prioritize an Xbox build for a new Persona game in the first place), meaning Persona 6 development would have began years ago, when I strongly doubt Xbox was even a platform for consideration as the game was going into pre-production and then full production.

So a sudden timeline where we get a Xbox Series X & S version of Persona 6, Day 1 with PS5 and PC (and it might be a reach to say that even PC is getting it Day 1), considering the impact in development the game would have had anyway due to the COVID lockdowns through 2020 and most of 2021 (slowing development on whatever builds were currently in work at the time), very likely would mean end-polish and optimization resources for the PS5 and/or PC versions would have been divested towards hurriedly building a Series X/S version of the game and optimizing that. Considering, of course, that Persona 6 is coming in 2023, which seems quite likely as Sega/Atlus need something big for 2023 and it's not going to be another Sonic game, or Yakuza Ishin which is mainly a next-gen port of a PS3 game.

Something will have to fill that spot and Persona 6 is most likely to be the game. And I'm leaning on that being a PS5 launch exclusive most likely, with maybe a PC version within 6-12 months (similar to FF XVI), if there isn't one Day 1. I can't realistically see a Series X or S version of Persona 6 coming in 2023, but I can see one happening in 2024, a year after release. But this is all assuming Atlus haven't spent the last few months upwards a year or so rushing to do a Series X & S build for the game, though it wouldn't be the first time Sega's demanded such sudden dev shifts that'd have cascading effects on versions of the games already deep into development. We saw it sadly happen with Sonic '06 a long time ago.

You make a lot of good points but Atlus was working on Royal and other ports plus just teased Persona 6 a month ago where as Persona 5 was first announced in 2013. If anything, I would think that Persona 6 is more of a 2025 release. I don't see 2023 happening at all especially if it's not shown at TGA in a few weeks.

Sega has the other Yakuza game with Kiryu for late 2023. We'll see how it all goes but if Sega/Atlus want Persona to grow as a franchise/series, keeping it exclusive to PlayStation with no PC or Xbox day one release isn't going to make that happen.

As for development and whatnot, it's all x86 and all games are developed on PC's anyway so I don't really see a port taking all that long and then optimizing the game. If anything, having it get an extra 6 months for example in order for it to release on PC and Xbox day one would be the way to go if they want the franchise to grow. I don't believe that Sony has any paid exclusivity for the game as they did with previous games in the series or Yakuza. It was just a matter of Sega ignoring Xbox. Now, with them being buddies with Microsoft, I don't see them doing what previously did.
 

Bryank75

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Hoping to see jaw-dropping sales numbers for the rest of the year (for PS5). If they want to make those targets they set themselves.
 
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thelastword

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Now that PS is slaying with sales numbers worldwide, we are getting less articles online and less threads about sales on forums, the sales matters guys have gone "mum" and have relegated to "MAU, engagement" even though they are suffering there as well. PS is not only selling hardware at a high rate, but it is selling software and accessories off the flood gate as well. Modern Warfare 2 and many third party software sell much better on PS vs the competition.
 
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Bryank75

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Now that PS is slaying with sales numbers worldwide, we are getting less articles online and less threads about sales on forums, the sales matters guys have gone "mum" and have relegated to "MAU, engagement" even though they are suffering there as well. PS is not only selling hardware at a high rate, but it is selling software and accessories off the flood gate as well. Modern Warfare 2 and many third party software sell much better on PS vs the competition.

Same every generation, the media and co try to give a big psuh to MSFT out the gate and then as gamers choose based on quality and what is actually offered, then media has less influence and they become quiet and pretend to go along with things..... until the next generation. Same cycle, every time.
 

ethomaz

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Now that PS is slaying with sales numbers worldwide, we are getting less articles online and less threads about sales on forums, the sales matters guys have gone "mum" and have relegated to "MAU, engagement" even though they are suffering there as well. PS is not only selling hardware at a high rate, but it is selling software and accessories off the flood gate as well. Modern Warfare 2 and many third party software sell much better on PS vs the competition.
Happens all the time.

Like when everybody was talking how powerful was Series X to rip off the overclocked and dated PS5 hardware.
The systems launched and everybody gone mute with how impressive that overclocked and dated hardware delivered lol