The Iron Lords Podcast sends open letter to the CMA

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Satoru

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20 Jun 2022
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You are veeeery very wrong.

So Crackdown 3 wasn't first party? Sackboy Adventures? Returnal? What about Metroid Dread? Ratchet & Clank? Resistance?

A console manufacturer can fund external studios to develop games based on IPs they (will) own. Games would still be first party (or second party to differentiate with games built inhouse).

In case of Spider-Man, Marvel asked Sony to make a Spider-Man game, Sony chose Insomniac as a dev. While Spider-Man as a character is not owned by Sony, Insomniac's "Marvels Spider-Man" is a first party game. No one else outside of Sony could ever create a sequel to it set in the same "universe".

Spider-man ownership is split between Sony and Marvel Comics. I didn't by know who owns the specific "gaming" rights, but since Sony owns cinematographic rights and Marvel Comics owns Merch and Comic Book, it's probably an agreement between both on producing the game.
 

BloodMod

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Neither of those games are first party... Sony doesn't own From Software, and they didn't own Insomniac at time of release.
So, according to your bizarre definition, neither the first Forza Horizon, nor Crackdown 3, nor FS2020 were MS first-party exclusives just because those studios were not owned by them at that time.

Will the Perfect Dark remake not be a first-party exclusive then?

Think carefully about how your honesty is perceived before posting.
 
24 Jun 2022
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Anyone know where to send a letter? I might want to send them a few words 😁

FWIW, I wouldn't have a lot to say against the acquisition in itself, but I definitely think MS need to hold off on future acquisitions until they produce meaningful results with Zenimax, ABK and the 2018 acquisitions both in market scores and "attributable revenue" for a few years. If they can do that for say five years, and want to look into another publisher, then it should be okay. Otherwise in the meantime they can only buy developers with a market cap less than converted USD $500 million, and limited to three such gaming acquisitions during the five-year period.

Honestly think those are very fair terms, although it wouldn't absolve the other worry I have: if the ABK deal's approved it could open the floodgates for other giant tech companies and investment groups (Apple, Tencent, Sazzy Group etc.) to go after other games publishers and simply point to MS's ABK deal being approved to get regulators to approve their own acquisitions, which could lead to a huge destabilization of the 3P developer & publisher market adversely affecting platform holders such as Sony, Nintendo, and even Microsoft.

Which is why I'd feel other concessions would have to be imposed on the ABK deal even in addition to the stuff above I would personally suggest are in there, in order to set limits and conditions for other companies in a way that's clear & fair to what they can try doing with gaming acquisitions of their own.

Neither of those games are first party... Sony doesn't own From Software, and they didn't own Insomniac at time of release.

They co-funded both games and provided technical support, not to mention Insomniac have a history overwhelmingly on PlayStation platforms near-exclusively and From Software has a large stable of PlayStation exclusives as well (King's Field 1-4, interactive fiction games for PSP, Demon's Souls etc.), of their own volition (i.e not because Sony bought those games away from other platforms).

So ILP using those as examples is laughable at best.

Yeah both MS and Sony will typically refer to games they publish or fund/moneyhat as first party. Most of these in the past would be considered second party but that term seems to have vanished.

It makes sense. Before they acquired Playground, didn’t everyone consider Horizon to be first party?

I did, and yeah it's weird how "second-party" just vanished, like the mid-tier market at retail after halfway through 7th gen. Used to refer to Rare as 2nd Party as a kid but I didn't know Nintendo "only" owned 51% of their shares; I just called them 2nd-party because they weren't Nintendo but made games exclusively for Nintendo anyway.

But yes, Playground's relationship with Microsoft is a lot like Insomniac's with Sony, Rare with Nintendo (before being sold), or Lobotomy Software with Sega: practically exclusive or 1P-adjacent by association, even if they weren't wholly owned by a platform holder at the time.

You are veeeery very wrong.

So Crackdown 3 wasn't first party? Sackboy Adventures? Returnal? What about Metroid Dread? Ratchet & Clank? Resistance?

A console manufacturer can fund external studios to develop games based on IPs they (will) own. Games would still be first party (or second party to differentiate with games built inhouse).

In case of Spider-Man, Marvel asked Sony to make a Spider-Man game, Sony chose Insomniac as a dev. While Spider-Man as a character is not owned by Sony, Insomniac's "Marvels Spider-Man" is a first party game. No one else outside of Sony could ever create a sequel to it set in the same "universe".

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Dick Jones

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5 Jul 2022
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Spider-man ownership is split between Sony and Marvel Comics. I didn't by know who owns the specific "gaming" rights, but since Sony owns cinematographic rights and Marvel Comics owns Merch and Comic Book, it's probably an agreement between both on producing the game.
Sony own the movie rights to Spider-Man in perpetuity provided they produce a Spider-Man movie every few years.

All other rights are owned by Marvel [Disney]

Microsoft passed on Spider-Man while having a working relationship with Insomniac. Don't know why MS have issues with Sony's version.
 

DynamiteCop

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2 Jul 2022
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So, according to your bizarre definition, neither the first Forza Horizon, nor Crackdown 3, nor FS2020 were MS first-party exclusives just because those studios were not owned by them at that time.

Will the Perfect Dark remake not be a first-party exclusive then?

Think carefully about how your honesty is perceived before posting.
That is correct.
 

Satoru

Limitless
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20 Jun 2022
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Sony own the movie rights to Spider-Man in perpetuity provided they produce a Spider-Man movie every few years.

All other rights are owned by Marvel [Disney]

Microsoft passed on Spider-Man while having a working relationship with Insomniac. Don't know why MS have issues with Sony's version.

Cool, thanks for letting me know :) I wasn't aware.
 
P

peter42O

Guest
The Iron Lords are great. Love King David as he's freaking hilarious. I like Cognito as he's a fellow 49ers fan. Sovereign is the best of the bunch. Addict is okay.

With that said, I don't believe that CMA should be accepting anything from the public as that's just fucking stupid in my opinion and I don't believe that the Iron Lords or anyone for that matter should be sending letters. Shit is becoming a circus in my opinion.

But whatever. Approved or blocked, sooner this entire shit ends, the better.
 

Snake29

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21 Jun 2022
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One of the ways in which the magnitude of Sony’s current market lead harms consumers is in its ability to secure full or timed exclusives from third-party developers and publishers. Due to the commanding market lead it has gained over the past nine years, Sony is capable of securing favorable conditions on these deals in a way that Microsoft cannot.

Cannot, or MS just didn't bother/couldn't outbit, or devs pitched their games first for Sony instead of MS, because of userbase? Securing timed exclusive deals isn't exclusive to Sony. I mean, Did deals like STALKER 2, Warhammer, High on Life, ExoMecha, The Medium and all others they have right now fall from the sky or something?
 
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Heisenberg007

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21 Jun 2022
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Neither of those games are first party... Sony doesn't own From Software, and they didn't own Insomniac at time of release.
So Flight Simulator, all Forza Horizon games (before PlayGround's acquisition), Ori and the Blind Forest, Ori and the Will of the Wisps, Contraband, Project Dragon by IOI, Kojima's Xbox game, etc. are all not first-party games, right?

Why aren't they on PlayStation? They should be on PlayStation, right? Is Microsoft paying money to block those games coming on PlayStation? 😮
 
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Heisenberg007

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I guess Microsoft Flight Simulator and Ori should come to PS5 then, right?

We can also look forward to MS publishing the Kojima game on PS5 too, yeah?
Considering that Phil Spencer is for "gaming for everyone, everywhere" and wants "more people to play Xbox games, not fewer," I'm sure Xbox will release all these "third-party" games on PlayStation and Nintendo. Any day now.

Xbox is so consumer-friendly and pro-gamer after all.
 

KnittedKnight

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13 Jul 2022
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Mission accomplished? Got the attention of his diehard following, cementing his Xbox credential allegiance + got mindshare from Sony fans discussing the "nonsense" (Youtuber clout 101) + any attention by MS marketing dept is a freebie bonus. After all, many have been angling to be the next Parris Lilly for quite a while now. Kinda funny how MS keeps the pipe stretched thin for them - capacity: 1 at a time only. Once in a while you get these stunts to bust through the door.
 
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