[Windows Central] Xbox's biggest problem right now isn't games. It's hardware

24 Jun 2022
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Because why would you want to buy a Dreamcast to pirate or the first MS console which was niche AF (should have called it the anglobox)
When you could pirate a PS2 which was the most popular console? It's not nonsense step outside of the G7 bubble to know how it was back then in most of the planet.

All those kids and teens that grew with modded PS1 and PS2 got jobs as young adults and could make money to afford original games on the PS3 here and there. Would you want to miss the next god of war, gran Turismo or metal gear after 10 years with the brand?

Sony also made some a key decision on the 7th gen. Even more important than all exclusives put together to ensure fidelity on cost sensitive markets: Free online vs Xbox paid. That forced former pirates to make a decision: keep pirating with the 360 (RGH - JTAG) but lose online capabilities or buy less games but play with your friends online for free. Folks chose the latter option. And that's how Xbox basically lost all non core markets with the exception of maybe Mexico.

PS3 could still be pirated with methods like CFW or multiman but 360 piracy was far more popular.

You're acting like Sony intentionally designed their systems to encourage piracy. They did not. You're also overestimating how much piracy actually happened; it may have been popular in smaller markets but we're talking about significantly smaller markets back in the day, who cumulatively did not contribute much to the PS1 or PS2's sales numbers for hardware and software.

In the biggest markets, piracy was much less common in relation to the number of people who didn't have the skills or knew the people to hook them up with pirated games. And, as game rentals were still pretty popular, for many it just made more sense to rent a game from Blockbuster or whatever for a few days, play it, beat it, and return it within the 5 days or so vs. jump through hoops to pirate the game. Mainly because even those getting the games through pirating, still had to pay for the game and/or the service.

And, again, you had to know the right people to even be in that circle to pirate. And also, the situation you describe is absolutely not the only or main reason Xbox lost non-US/UK markets in the 360 gen. The simple truth is, Microsoft didn't give a shit for markets outside of those two, and pretty much stopped trying in Japan after the first three years in that gen outside of getting Square-Enix to make a version of XIII for the 360, and stuff like that. Which would mean, you had a decent number of people in those ROTW markets who were buying the games legit, and felt Microsoft wasn't catering to their needs for printed copies or localization, or advertising etc.

That's been a problem for the Xbox brand for over a decade, actually.
 

ksdixon

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22 Jun 2022
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I think he’s just nervous his xbox will become more irrelevant as the console generation goes on and microsoft start making more money from pc and mobile
Microsoft will never put the proper pieces together. Regardless of money.

They are, ironically, often too early and too bullheaded "this is the way" (like GamePass). Well, actually MS, your ideas mostly suck, and bury the glimmer of forward thinking behind horrific execution.

In 2012 I had a Windows 8 touchscreen Surface Pro 1. Touchscreen/pen, full x86 windows, breakaway keyboard... And they couldn't just add these quality of life features as extras and neatly integrat them. No, they had to remove the start menu and force fullscreen modern apps (both relented-on too late with win8.1), and kill any proper adoption/likeability of 8. They should have listenesd to the pre release 8.0 feedback and made them toggle-able settings during setup/easily findable customisation to change back. Don't even get me started on the Surface Duo.
 

ksdixon

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Nah, if they had been able to get something good out of their studios it would not matter.

And who buys a next gen console for loading times?
Me. If I could have a PS4 with PS5 load times and almost everything else PS4-like (dashboard, controller, company focus etc) that'd be the dream.
 

ksdixon

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SATA SSDs are a dime a dozen these days, it will not be as fast, but it will still be faster than with the original HDD.
True. Well, I mean PS5 also has other quality of life/passage of time things like better WiFi or Bluetooth. I just meant like have the PS5 under the hood improvements, but essentially wrapped in PS4 skin.
 

flaccidsnake

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A first party game sold on Steam is not a lost console customer. Hardware is low margin (or even loss) compared to software. A Steam user paying 60-70 for your game is exactly what you want as a publisher.
 
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Alabtrosmyster

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A first party game sold on Steam is not a lost console customer. Hardware is low margin (or even loss) compared to software. A Steam user paying 60-70 for your game is exactly what you want as a publisher.
For Sony/Nintendo the console hardware sales are about bringing people to the ecosystem/store. Then they collect a 30% royalty fee on all sales and 100% when they sell something on their own platform.

When Sony sells on epic/steam they pay the platform fee to the holder, as well as making the competing platform more relevant with the addition of notable games being released on it.

This is not clear that Sony makes that much money in the end, or at all, even if they don't lose that many console sales in the short term.

For Xbox that's a different story, their console sales are abysmal and people don't buy that many games on Xbox either. So releasing on PC is a no brainer (they probably want to use their games as a lure gamers to the windows store, and definitely GP/xcloud).
 

Bryank75

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KidSmoove now wants Apple to buy Xbox...

You can imagine the response from the other Xbox fans! Hilarious.

Apple don't give a fuck about console.
 
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24 Jun 2022
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A first party game sold on Steam is not a lost console customer. Hardware is low margin (or even loss) compared to software. A Steam user paying 60-70 for your game is exactly what you want as a publisher.

Incorrect. Putting your games, as a platform holder, Day 1 on Steam also convinces console owners to do their third-party game shopping on Steam as well, rather than, say, the Xbox Storefront. So now, Microsoft is getting a lower cut in revenue, on top of losing out on their 30% cut of all 3P games with those customers who decide to go PC/Steam over Xbox console.

And to make it even worst, the users who are heavy buyers of MS games on Steam, were very likely whale enthusiasts in the Xbox console ecosystem previously. Meaning they actually spent the most amount of money on Xbox products (hardware, software, services) compared to the average Xbox console owner. So these people may account for, say, 2% or 5% of the total buying audience, but may represent 10%, 15% or even more of the actual revenue generated in the console ecosystem.

Microsoft basically gave them everything they could've wanted on the console, on PC/Steam, Day 1, and they lost a MASSIVE amount of their whale enthusiasts as a result. It's a mistake we're hoping Sony doesn't repeat, hence the critical criticisms some of us have towards their PC strategy ATM.
 

Systemshock2023

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You're acting like Sony intentionally designed their systems to encourage piracy. They did not. You're also overestimating how much piracy actually happened; it may have been popular in smaller markets but we're talking about significantly smaller markets back in the day, who cumulatively did not contribute much

They certainly didn't go the extra mile to prevent it right? I give them the benefit of the doubt with the PS1 as it was their first foray into consoles but after it's success and massive piracy rates you do nothing with the PS2? As early as in mid 2001 you could see modded PS2 in south America at least. Not even Sony style shops on shopping malls would sell PS games as piracy was so rampant, they didn't even try.

Those smaller markets are not small at all and they do add up lots of users that are key for brand awareness (eastern Europe, middle east, latin america, ASEAN)

Back then Sony had the financial muscle to accept earning less in those markets in order to establish themselves there. They broke even or earned a small margin by selling the console and accessories.

Third parties on the other hand... the struggle of AA games on the 7th gen was not only due to "the jump to HD"
 

Old Gamer

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KidSmoove now wants Apple to buy Xbox...

You can imagine the response from the other Xbox fans! Hilarious.

Apple don't give a fuck about console.
I wouldn't laugh. Only way I would ever consider Xbox again is if it no longer was associated to MS.
 
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