From 2017-2023, the console games market has grown +59%. PC only +37%; has shrunk since 2022

Yurinka

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@Yurinka do you not realise PC has subscription services available or is that just something you need to overlook to propagate the false narrative than PC software sales are higher than console software sales?
Yes, as I mentioned they are included in the Newzoo report and in the IDG report provided by Sony (which gets bigger numbers for both console and PC compared to the report themselves provided).

And wtf are you talking about false narratives? I'm showing you the factual data and you claim it's wrong because of potatoes, not providing nothing that proves it wrong other than your personal guesses.

Add in MTX and add in subscriptions and it's simply no contest. PC has declined from last year while consoles have grown.
MTX are already included in all the graphs.

Just to be clear, your argument is that game subs can bridge a 20-30b gap in console revenue (and are 66%+ as large as the software sales and MTX segment) but make no difference to PC spend, and in fact decrease PC spend when included, because...companies pay PC users for subscriptions and it counts as negative revenue?
No, I never said that. I shown different graphs, some of them mention they include game subs and show a bigger number than others that specify that don't include game subs.

And other ones that don't specify if include them or not, but pretty much match one of these two cases. So when match the high one, pretty likely is because they're including there something else, like console hardware or game subs.

Regarding the proportion between game subs revenue and console game sales+game adons revenue, I did show graphs and also shown the number the specific case of Sony for 2022.

The difference seems to be aprox. 3 (game sales+addons):1 (game subs) for both Sony and the console market. In PC seem to be way smaller, I assume because they don't need them to play online. We can see it here, subs are around between a third or a forth of console game sales+addons:

image.png


Until you answer how one chart (imaginary Pelham Smithers guesses) can have PC at 45b and the other (Newzoo), which apparently includes more segments, at 38b, you can't use both charts and hold them to be of equal value.
Nobody has the exact revenue numbers from the whole industry. They have the numbers shared by publisher/devs associations from many of the main countries plus the data publicly shared by many public companies plus the numbers shared with them by their customers, including platform holders. Plus surveys and extrapolations from previous years and other studies from other firms.

With all this data, they extrapolate the numbers for the other companies and make an estimate for the revenue made that year.

Regarding the estimates for future years, they basically make projections based on the trend of previous years adding tweaks with the data they consider may be important in future years (like GTA6 releasing next year, Switch 2 releasing probably late this year/early next one, PS6 pretty likely releasing late 2027/early 2028 etc).

Their estimates vary over time depending on the data each one has. There are different firms, each one obviously posting different numbers, specially because normally they count different things (sometimes they include game subs, sometimes they include hardware, sometimes also accesories, etc). Or sometimes adjusting or not the inflation.

So it's better to don't take their numbers as something set in stone, but instead as rough numbers to get an idea, and also is better to check multiple reports from different sources to contrast them and have a general view of what the analysts think and see the pattern/trend over time, instead of believing what only one of them says in just a single specific report.

She said she doesn't know, as she doesn't frequent stupid people.
Well, she told me her French is better than my Mandarin. But well, I'll stop here xDD
 
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Cool hand luke

Cool hand luke

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Nobody has the exact revenue numbers from the whole industry. They have the numbers shared by publisher/devs associations from many of the main countries plus the data publicly shared by many public companies plus the numbers shared with them by their customers, including platform holders. Plus surveys and extrapolations from previous years and other studies from other firms.

With all this data, they extrapolate the numbers for the other companies and make an estimate for the revenue made that year.

Regarding the estimates for future years, they basically make projections based on the trend of previous years adding tweaks with the data they consider may be important in future years (like GTA6 releasing next year, Switch 2 releasing probably late this year/early next one, PS6 pretty likely releasing late 2027/early 2028 etc).

Their estimates vary over time depending on the data each one has. There are different firms, each one obviously posting different numbers, specially because normally they count different things (sometimes they include game subs, sometimes they include hardware, sometimes also accesories, etc). Or sometimes adjusting or not the inflation.


So it's better to don't take their numbers as something set in stone, but instead as rough numbers to get an idea, and also is better to check multiple reports from different sources to contrast them and have a general view of what the analysts think and see the pattern/trend over time, instead of believing what only one of them says in just a single specific report.
This is an unsatisfactory answer. I've crossed out your distractions (we're not talking about future years and estimates for the same, and we're all aware there are different segments being reported on/estimated in diff reports).

Let me put it plainer:

You give credence to a report which has PC (software only) at 45b and consoles at 30b.

A separate report which you give credence to, and which includes additional revenue segments, has PC at 38b and consoles at 53b.

Moreover, you give MORE credence to the fantasy Pelham Smithers 'report' by situating PC (game only!!!) revenue in the 40-45b ballpark, but believe consoles are only at 30b.

1. Is revenue from software and game subs > revenue from software only?
2. Is 38b > 45b?

It's Yes/No and you have to answer the same to both questions.
 

arvfab

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Well, she told me her French is better than my Mandarin. But well, I'll stop here xDD

As I said, she doesn't talk to stupid, so I really doubt you spoke to her.
 
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Yurinka

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This is an unsatisfactory answer. I've crossed out your distractions (we're not talking about future years and estimates for the same, and we're all aware there are different segments being reported on/estimated in diff reports).

Let me put it plainer:

You give credence to a report which has PC (software only) at 45b and consoles at 30b.

A separate report which you give credence to, and which includes additional revenue segments, has PC at 38b and consoles at 53b.

Moreover, you give MORE credence to the fantasy Pelham Smithers 'report' by situating PC (game only!!!) revenue in the 40-45b ballpark, but believe consoles are only at 30b.

1. Is revenue from software and game subs > revenue from software only?
2. Is 38b > 45b?

It's Yes/No and you have to answer the same to both questions.
You are the one saying I give more credence to one than to another, not me.

They are all estimations, they all measure different things and the Pelham Smithers is -unlike the other ones- inflation adjusted.

I prefer to see diferent ones, contrast them and take them as aproximated numbers, which is what they are. To see patterns and trends, and get rough ideas of the size of each things.

Not as exact numbers, because nobody knows the exact numbers since there are many countries not tracked and many companies don't share their numbers. They are estimations, extrapolations.

You are the one who rejects the market data, not me. So you're the one who should reply the logic and maths question.

Instead of yes or no, you will get the same 5 slides posted again. Just give it up and start a conversation with a wall, you will have a more intelligent conversation partner.
I suggest you to put me in ignore and stop spamming me with your troll comments, replies and emojis.
 
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anonpuffs

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So the $30b figure doesn't include subscriptions, tell me do you really think 40% of console game revenue is from subs? (I can tell you already, the answer is not even close)
 
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Cool hand luke

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So the $30b figure doesn't include subscriptions, tell me do you really think 40% of console game revenue is from subs? (I can tell you already, the answer is not even close)
That's the only way to reconcile his position, as well as assuming Newzoo (a PC parts seller) is overestimating the console market and that subscription revenue doesn't exist on PC AND Newzoo is grossly underestimating PC, given that he's confident consoles were only at 30b in software revenue (i.e. he thinks Pelham Smith's crayon chart is more reliable).
 
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arvfab

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Here some interesting readings regarding the "most representative" videogames country:


It is worth mentioning that Tencent and NetEase collectively represent over half of the total share for domestic computer and mobile games revenue.


I suggest you to put me in ignore and stop spamming me with your troll comments, replies and emojis.

Nah, I want to have a good laugh reading a bit of non-sense.
 
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Gods&Monsters

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Here some interesting readings regarding the "most representative" videogames country:

All these billions are added under "PC gaming" and then the PCMR come here to brag about these numbers like it means something. We all know these numbers are 100% irrelevant for Sony PC ports and the AAA industry in general (EA, Ubisoft, Take 2, WB, etc). There's no market for them there.

It reminds me of xbots bragging about MAUs of people playing Solitaire on Windows🤦‍♂️
 

rofif

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All these billions are added under "PC gaming" and then the PCMR come here to brag about these numbers like it means something. We all know these numbers are 100% irrelevant for Sony PC ports and the AAA industry in general (EA, Ubisoft, Take 2, WB, etc). There's no market for them there.

It reminds me of xbots bragging about MAUs of people playing Solitaire on Windows🤦‍♂️
All that needs to be seen is numbers for top player counts and active player counts for ps games on steam.
I suppose forspoken did better than uncharted 4 and that game flopped so hard it closed down a studio.
 
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Yurinka

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It is interesting that, for example, Capcom sees the future in PC and not in consoles

Capcom never said doesn't see future in console. They considered that the % of their sales was smaller than it should, and focused on improving their efforts on PC to grow their business with the goal of having half of their game revene from PC.

Some time later they achieved it.
 

Yurinka

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So the $30b figure doesn't include subscriptions, tell me do you really think 40% of console game revenue is from subs? (I can tell you already, the answer is not even close)
See this graph from IDG: according to their estimate in 2022 there was $30B made from game revenue (phsical & digital software + addons) in the whole console market which adds to $9B from game subs (which is as big as 30% of the game revenue).

It's a combined $39B of console software revenue. If you add console hardware, then it's $55B of total console revenue for the whole console market.

image.png


In this post I detailed Sony's numbers for CY2022: they did $11.07B in game revenue and $2.97B from game subs revenue, a total of $14.04B software revenue (as big as 26,82% of their game revenue of that calendar year).
 
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anonpuffs

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See this graph from IDG: in 2022 there's $30B from game revenue (phsical & digital software + addons) which adds to $9B from game subs (which is as big as 30% of the game revenue).

It's a combined $39B of console software revenue. If you add console hardware, then it's $55B of total console revenue.

image.png


In this post I detailed Sony's numbers for CY2022: they did $11B in game revenue and $3B from game subs, a total of $14B.
8b is not 30% of 30b. It is 27%, which is far less than the 40% you would need for 30b->50b from subscription revenue.
 
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Gods&Monsters

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It is interesting that, for example, Capcom sees the future in PC and not in consoles

Remij is back with his bullshit article from 2021 🤣

Capcom had an off-year on consoles because Monster Hunter Rise was released on Switch and then on PC (PS in 2023) but Playstation is their biggest platform by far.
 

Witcher

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Remij is back with his bullshit article from 2021 🤣

Capcom had an off-year on consoles because Monster Hunter Rise was released on Switch and then on PC (PS in 2023) but Playstation is their biggest platform by far.
Capcom still thinks PC is the main platform for its videogames