How long can Microsoft float on goodwill? | Opinion

[Zzero]

well, they have no goodwill in Japan or Asia, with Japan especially hating Xbox.

Japan no longer cares about PlayStation either, it's all in on Switch, look at the weekly sales charts there and try to find the non-Switch SKUs, you'll be hard pressed to find more than three in the top 20.

Edit: Just looked and there were indeed only three Playstation SKUs in there this week. But it gets worse because two of them are One Piece Odyssey (PS4 and PS5 versions both charted) so Playstation's bacon is being saved by Bamco shovelware being shat out by gun for hire studios.

 

[thelastword]

Japan no longer cares about PlayStation either, it's all in on Switch, look at the weekly sales charts there and try to find the non-Switch SKUs, you'll be hard pressed to find more than three in the top 20.

Edit: Just looked and there were indeed only three Playstation SKUs in there this week. But it gets worse because two of them are One Piece Odyssey (PS4 and PS5 versions both charted) so Playstation's bacon is being saved by Bamco shovelware being shat out by gun for hire studios.

Japan is on a mobile craze, makes sense since they spend so much time mobile, on long train rides and long work hours. Sony needs to get a Vita 2 out.

 

[Dick Jones]

Japan no longer cares about PlayStation either, it's all in on Switch, look at the weekly sales charts there and try to find the non-Switch SKUs, you'll be hard pressed to find more than three in the top 20.

Edit: Just looked and there were indeed only three Playstation SKUs in there this week. But it gets worse because two of them are One Piece Odyssey (PS4 and PS5 versions both charted) so Playstation's bacon is being saved by Bamco shovelware being shat out by gun for hire studios.

There is only two ways Sony get big in Japan again
1. More mobile games. Isn't Nintendo only about 20% of the market once you include mobile with video games? Mobile gaming has potential financially (I need to wash after promoting the benefits of mobile gaming)
2. When Remote Play is flawless for most of the population with comfortable and cheapish controller adaptors for mobiles.

 

[Kokoloko]

Eventually there games will come out. They should be decent. So I dont think it will run out lots.

But I don’t think they will ever reach the Xbox 360 highs again. Everything aligned perfect for them the start of that gen.

Also when it comes to shadow drops. They are fine and welcomed, especially for smaller/cheaper games which is lacking from Playstation atm like the old days and early PS4.
But so is knowing games way in advance for me. Maybe just mention it like film studios do instead of showing something when its way out.
Im always excited to know when studios have confirmed to work on something like Metroid Prime 4

 

[Kokoloko]

There is only two ways Sony get big in Japan again
1. More mobile games. Isn't Nintendo only about 20% of the market once you include mobile with video games? Mobile gaming has potential financially (I need to wash after promoting the benefits of mobile gaming)
2. When Remote Play is flawless for most of the population with comfortable and cheapish controller adaptors for mobiles.

Yep and also.

3. They do a PSP3 that can play current games like Switch/Steamdeck. Final Fantasy 14, 16 and 7Remake, next Dragon Quest, GT7, Street Fighter 6 and Tekken 8, RE4. Monster Hunter World. Would all sell loads more in Japan if they were portable.

Atm Japan is happy with Switch quality games, Im sure they will enjoy the jump in graphics.

Its not like they were loyal to Nintendo for Wii U, Gamecube, N64 in Japan. Its mostly they love portable games

 

[Bryank75]

I disagree with this whole idea that you have to bring everything to a mobile platform to have relevance in Japan.

I think Sony should look to get as many of the big franchises to be exclusive to PS and then have mobile versions that have extremely rare items and upgrades that are on;y accessible through owning the console tie-in game.....

That way, after people play the mobile version while commuting....instead of continuing to play on mobile when they get home, they would then switch over to console to play to get the better items and gear in the bigger console version.

Plus, I think we have seen very healthy sales recently, even though it is still supply constrained.

 

[Zzero]

Yep and also.

3. They do a PSP3 that can play current games like Switch/Steamdeck. Final Fantasy 14, 16 and 7Remake, next Dragon Quest, GT7, Street Fighter 6 and Tekken 8, RE4. Monster Hunter World. Would all sell loads more in Japan if they were portable.

Atm Japan is happy with Switch quality games, Im sure they will enjoy the jump in graphics.

Its not like they were loyal to Nintendo for Wii U, Gamecube, N64 in Japan. Its mostly they love portable games

Due to screen sizes graphics for mobile/handhelds matter less (hence DS/3DS whooping the PSP family.)

I also don't think Japan is a big enough market to support developing a unit just for it. That's what the Vita ended up being and even Sony viewed it as a failure.

 

[Muddasar]

Yep and also.

3. They do a PSP3 that can play current games like Switch/Steamdeck. Final Fantasy 14, 16 and 7Remake, next Dragon Quest, GT7, Street Fighter 6 and Tekken 8, RE4. Monster Hunter World. Would all sell loads more in Japan if they were portable.

Atm Japan is happy with Switch quality games, Im sure they will enjoy the jump in graphics.

Its not like they were loyal to Nintendo for Wii U, Gamecube, N64 in Japan. Its mostly they love portable games

Exactly they are loyal to Mobile/Handhelds not any gaming company.

N64, Gamecube and Wii U were relative failures in Japan.

Sony needs to get its act together and release a portable handheld capable of playing PS5 games.

If the 1.8tf PS4 can do it theres nothing stopping a Steamdeck spec handheld doing it.

 

[AshHunter216]

I disagree with this whole idea that you have to bring everything to a mobile platform to have relevance in Japan.

I think Sony should look to get as many of the big franchises to be exclusive to PS and then have mobile versions that have extremely rare items and upgrades that are on;y accessible through owning the console tie-in game.....

That way, after people play the mobile version while commuting....instead of continuing to play on mobile when they get home, they would then switch over to console to play to get the better items and gear in the bigger console version.

Plus, I think we have seen very healthy sales recently, even though it is still supply constrained.

I dunno, the only truly successful console brand over there right now is doing it using a handheld, I doubt even Nintendo would do as well over there if they went back to a traditional non-portable console.

 

[thelastword]

I disagree with this whole idea that you have to bring everything to a mobile platform to have relevance in Japan.

I think Sony should look to get as many of the big franchises to be exclusive to PS and then have mobile versions that have extremely rare items and upgrades that are on;y accessible through owning the console tie-in game.....

That way, after people play the mobile version while commuting....instead of continuing to play on mobile when they get home, they would then switch over to console to play to get the better items and gear in the bigger console version.

Plus, I think we have seen very healthy sales recently, even though it is still supply constrained.

A console can still do well in Japan, I find the PS5 is doing pretty decently seeing as it's supply constrained and the PS4 did pretty good numbers as well. However, the mobile/handheld market is really the dominant force right now in Japan, so perhaps Sony can release a handheld to see how it shakes. They just need to get a few smaller dev teams to focus strictly on Handheld development.

Sony doing a new handheld is actually interesting because the hardware they could put into a small form factor would be pretty impressive. AMD has a new APU coming up that's really a tour de force.....I think they should at least test the waters, they have Square behind them and lots more. Steam Deck is doing well, ancient Switch hardware is still doing numbers. I think Sony could easily beat them on hardware and features, just like Vita, that handheld was ahead of it's time.

 

[Kokoloko]

Exactly they are loyal to Mobile/Handhelds not any gaming company.

N64, Gamecube and Wii U were relative failures in Japan.

Sony needs to get its act together and release a portable handheld capable of playing PS5 games.

If the 1.8tf PS4 can do it theres nothing stopping a Steamdeck spec handheld doing it.

Yep. Japan doesnt give much of a shit about Nintendo as those consoles clearly showed.

Well the Steamdeck will be playing Returnal and TLOU1 Remake in a few months, which are both PS5 exclusives not cross gen etc.
So no excuses to why Sony can’t have the Tech to do the same in 2023/2024

Last time I brought up PSP3 playing PS4/PS5 games here and other forum, people said it was crazy and impossible. But Steamdecks gonna do it soon so lol at them. So no reason even better tech in 2023/2024 cant.

Nintendo is just getting a free pass in Japan and even worldwide for the portable market
People bring up Vita, but all the issues they had Vita have disappeared.

1. No need for dedicated studios making dedicated games. Just do what Steamdeck and Switch are doing. Handhelds can now play downscaled versions of Console/PC games. Obviously there will be portable minded games but you have the PS4/PS5 library to fall on.

2. L1/R1/L2/R2 Shoulder buttons. So no issues porting games. Vita didnt have it. Switch and SteamDeck do

3. MicroSD for memory lol

It will increase software sales and hardware sales in Japan massively. And it will at the very least take a bite out of the portable pie Nintendo is holding worldwide. Without any struggle.
10-20% of that portable pie plus the console market pie and it will be enough, let alone if it starts doing OG PSP numbers.

Im pretty sure PSP3 software sales would be better than both VR and PC adventures that Sony is focusing on

 

[Swift_Star]

The ZeniMax/Bethesda acquisition was completed in 2021. That was 2 yeras ago.
Developing an AAA game takes time. Especially if its a new IP. Just ask Sony. Horizon Zero Dawn was 8 years in development.

Ghostwire Tokyo and Deathloop came out. But because Sony made a deal for timed exclusivity both games didn't release on Xbox yet. Microsoft's 1st party studios still managed to release Age of Empires II: Definitive Edition, MS Flight Simulator, Psychonauts 2, Age of Empires IV, Forza Horizon 5, Halo Infinite, As Dusk Falls, Grounded, Pentiment, Hi-Fi Rush and more.

This year we will get Redfall, Starfield, Minecraft Legends, Forza Motorsport, Ghostwire Tokyo, Deathloop and maybe even more.
That's a lot. Compare this to Sony's output atm. Spider-Man, MLB The Show and...? VR shovelware?
Microsoft acquired all these studios a few years ago. Then they acquired publishers like ZeniMax/Bethesda and soon Activision-Blizzard. The games are coming. But AAA games take time. 2023 will be great and 2024 will be even better.
Microsoft is doing just fine.

Too many excuses, no games shown.

 

[Bodycount611]

you really have to ask yourself, what can MS really do, at this point, with them trailing so far behind?

First, they need to craft a game as fine as Ghost of Tsushima.

Then, they need to top Horizon Zero Dawn in the visuals and open world space.

then, create 2 more new AAA cinematic blockbuster IP ala Uncharted and TLOU, both of which need to score in the 90's and sweep GOTY awards.

then top them both with a maserclass best-in-industry SP experience that looks and scores on par with GOW... and GOW: Ragnarok.

Next, after that, we'll need two, yes two superhero games to go toe to toe with SpiderMan and Wolverine. Nothing Short of Batman and superman will do.

Oh, and a JRPG exclusive on par with FF16. An FPS studio on par with Bungie. And then to top it all off, sell more than 5 units a month in japan, to round all the gaps in japanese releases they miss.

let's face facts here:

 

[Kokoloko]

Due to screen sizes graphics for mobile/handhelds matter less (hence DS/3DS whooping the PSP family.)

I also don't think Japan is a big enough market to support developing a unit just for it. That's what the Vita ended up being and even Sony viewed it as a failure.

The Vita was a failure but that doesn’t mean there next handheld will be. By that logic Wii shouldn’t have succeeded after 2 failures in N64 and Gamecube. Or Wii U shouldnt have failed because the Wii did well.

The PSP did well in Japan and worldwide and it’s total sales were higher than 3DS currently.

A PSP3 would not have the same issues as the Vita, so saying it wouldnt do well because of that doesnt make sense. Plus its not just the Japanese market, its worldwide. DS and PSP sold tons of software, no reason they cant again especially with how well 1st party games are selling now worldwide.
Games like Final Fantasy 16, 7Remake, Dragon Quest, Monster Hunter World etc wont get ignored on a portable system In Japan, just like they done well with the PSP games even with the DS breaking records.

Id say graphics have mattered now because we’ve gone from 3DS graphics to actual Home Console/PC Graphics which is probably the biggest jump in graphics for portable games In a long time if not ever.
Switch Is hugely popular because it can play kind of console looking games compared to the limit 3DS had

 

[Zzero]

Yep. Japan doesnt give much of a shit about Nintendo as those consoles clearly showed.

Interesting preposition. Lets see what a quick Google search has to say about it...

Japanese games market top sellers of 2022:
1. [NSW] Pokemon Scarlet / Violet – 4,338,931 / NEW
2. [NSW] Splatoon 3 – 3,687,814 / NEW
3. [NSW] Pokemon Legends: Arceus – 2,314,806 / NEW
4. [NSW] Kirby and the Forgotten Land – 969,047 / NEW
5. [NSW] Nintendo Switch Sports – 887,722 / NEW
6. [NSW] Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – 742,018 / 5,014,375
7. [NSW] Minecraft – 548,415 / 2,960,006
8. [NSW] Mario Party Superstars – 485,594 / 1,114,132
9. [NSW] Super Smash Bros. Ultimate – 441,053 / 5,065,191
10. [PS4] Elden Ring – 356,711 / NEW

Oh shit, 8 of those are published directly by Nintendo or a company owned by them and Sony and Microsoft are actually equals with only one game per. PS one week ago Animal Crossing: New Horizons was officially revealed as the best selling Japanese games market release of all time.

The rest of your post is clown-speak from a fool. The only way Sony goes back to handhelds is if they need a tax write-off.

 

[MScarpa]

well, they have no goodwill in Japan or Asia, with Japan especially hating Xbox.

Unfortunately Japan is a dead market. USA is the dominant market, followed by everyone else. Is what it is.

 

[peter42O]

I disagree with this whole idea that you have to bring everything to a mobile platform to have relevance in Japan.

I think Sony should look to get as many of the big franchises to be exclusive to PS and then have mobile versions that have extremely rare items and upgrades that are on;y accessible through owning the console tie-in game.....

That way, after people play the mobile version while commuting....instead of continuing to play on mobile when they get home, they would then switch over to console to play to get the better items and gear in the bigger console version.

Plus, I think we have seen very healthy sales recently, even though it is still supply constrained.

Japan is dead for consoles including PlayStation. Even PlayStation 2 was under 25m and both PS3 and PS4 were around 10m. Japan is simply a mobile/handheld region. It doesn't matter what Sony (or Microsoft for that matter) does in regards to Japan console wise, it's not going to change.

 

[Kokoloko]

Interesting preposition. Lets see what a quick Google search has to say about it...

Japanese games market top sellers of 2022:
1. [NSW] Pokemon Scarlet / Violet – 4,338,931 / NEW
2. [NSW] Splatoon 3 – 3,687,814 / NEW
3. [NSW] Pokemon Legends: Arceus – 2,314,806 / NEW
4. [NSW] Kirby and the Forgotten Land – 969,047 / NEW
5. [NSW] Nintendo Switch Sports – 887,722 / NEW
6. [NSW] Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – 742,018 / 5,014,375
7. [NSW] Minecraft – 548,415 / 2,960,006
8. [NSW] Mario Party Superstars – 485,594 / 1,114,132
9. [NSW] Super Smash Bros. Ultimate – 441,053 / 5,065,191
10. [PS4] Elden Ring – 356,711 / NEW

Oh shit, 8 of those are published directly by Nintendo or a company owned by them and Sony and Microsoft are actually equals with only one game per. PS one week ago Animal Crossing: New Horizons was officially revealed as the best selling Japanese games market release of all time.

The rest of your post is clown-speak from a fool. The only way Sony goes back to handhelds is if they need a tax write-off.

Clearly you didnt read my post. Those are all on a portable hybrid games on the Switch.

I said, they love portable games.
Outside of that they don’t have a nation loyal to Nintendo like alot of people think because of Switch sales.
If Japan loved Nintendo so much they would of cared about Wii U, Gamecube, N64 etc.
Which they clearly didnt. The West kept Nintendo alive more than Japan ever did. Outide of the porable machines, they didnt care much.
The N64 sold less than the Sega Saturn in Japan, the Gamecube Failed and the Wii U talks for itself.

Even the Wii which is Nintendo’s best selling home console, only sold 4 million more in Japan, than PlayStation's worse selling console PS3, and at a 3rd of the price.
Ive bought every Nintendo console and portable, Im more loyal to Nintendo than Japan are lol.

Guaranteed if the Switch was a home console only, those sales wouldnt be anywhere near what they are now in Japan and Nintendo knows that. Its there Strength And they’ve doubled down on it.

How is the rest of my post clown speak?
-PSP selling well and selling more than 3DS? Thats true
-The PSP3 wouldnt have the same issues as PS Vita. Also true
-The Switch is hugely popular because it can play console like games, and handhelds have never done that before. True

So what exactly is clown talk?

 

[Zzero]

Clearly you didnt read my post. Those are all on a portable hybrid games on the Switch.

You said they didn't care about Nintendo but thats ridiculous. Nintendo/TPC published 8 of last year's 10 best selling games. The fact that they are on a Nintendo platform doesn't matter, Minecraft was on a Nintendo platform too. Pretty much everyone has access to the Switch and publishes on it but Nintendo's hardware sold best. When given the opportunity to buy any game ever, at all, of all time, Japan chose Animal Crossing: NH (there's no accounting for taste...)

How is the rest of my post clown speak?
-PSP selling well and selling more than 3DS? Thats true
-The PSP3 wouldnt have the same issues as PS Vita. Also true
-The Switch is hugely popular because it can play console like games, and handhelds have never done that before. True

So what exactly is clown talk?

Your first point is entirely irrelevant. The XBO outsold the Super Nintendo but is considered a failure while SNES was a success. Why? Because they were in different gens with differently sized markets. The PSP was from an era where handheld gaming was bigger and its actual competition was the DS, which outsold it 2 to 1. Vita fared identically to its actual competition, the 3DS. Your second point is also wrong because the biggest issue the Vita had was that it was competing as a handheld in the era of smart-phones and lost to those smartphones. 3DS, while its lifetime sales were large, had a large decline in popularity too. And smart phones are still out there, more ubiquitous than ever with the market for handheld gaming outside of Japan being niche. And as to your third point, the portable nature of the Switch was only one aspect of its popularity (key in Japan but perhaps secondary outside of it.) I'd say having a single platform (which Sony would not have if it re-entered portable gaming) to eliminate release droughts was just as important for Switch, as was having BotW at launch followed by a banger 2017 slate (actual games!) Now you can go and list hypothetical downports of nexgen titles as being comparable in interest to Nintendo's first party offerings but, and this is the key here, the PSP and Vita both had "portable-likes" of all of Sony's first party offerings and Monster Hunter to boot and they both got beaten.

To say nothing of the cost in dev-time to make downports for a device that would be built pretty much solely for the Japanese market. After the first year Sony's western studios would probably stop bothering, most western 3rd parties wouldn't even give it a try (for the most ambitious and/or poorly coded games it might be literally impossible anyway) and you'll be back to the Vita with Tearaway, Gravity Rush and nothing else for the west. And thats just the game drought issue. Lets talk about the cost of such a system. Nintendo sells the default Switch at between 250 and 300 dollars (temporary deals and bundles) and has since its launch 6 years ago. Thats old tech, with a "compromised" battery that doesn't last as long as Nintendo would have wanted. Your PSP3 is comparable to a Steam Deck (your words, not mine) which is a hundred dollars more and sporting a crappy/under-powered battery. For Sony it would be worse on that price front. I'm comparing it to the low end deck with the crappy memory card, nobody's going to want that, and Sony's probably going to have to chip in for a better battery too. And, if its going to be playing PS5 games, well, its actually going to have to be significantly better than a deck on the inside. All of that points to it not being able to hit 400 dollars as a price-point.

So yeah, I'd tell you to have fun with your white elephant but there'd be no point because Sony has no interest in making it.

 

[Bryank75]

Japan is dead for consoles including PlayStation. Even PlayStation 2 was under 25m and both PS3 and PS4 were around 10m. Japan is simply a mobile/handheld region. It doesn't matter what Sony (or Microsoft for that matter) does in regards to Japan console wise, it's not going to change.

10 million is a lot and too much to ignore and they are supply constrainted.

I think they should target getting 15 million or more sold this generation.

I know the population is shrinking in Japan and they are literally giving away houses there but I still think there are enough customers to buy max 20 million.