"Presentations & updates for PlayStation’s Strategy & Business May 2024 " Beyond boundaries". |UP| Info released & updated.

Cool close your IconEra account as well
@Box has every reason to abandon the sinking PS Ship 💅

I'm disappointed at how this forum is turning into XboxEra.

My thread privileges were removed because no one has a sense of humor anymore when it comes to gaming.

PlayStation is in inevitable decline, both quality & creatively.

Enjoy the shitshow that is the PS5/PC generation, weirdos.
 
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Remember 2022? We didn't get a showcase at all in 2022. And then we got an awful showcase in 2023. I'm sure the fanboys will still defend Sony no matter what, as for me I'm leaving this sinking ship
v9MrJZ.gif
 
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Gediminas

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@Box has every reason to abandon the sinking PS Ship 💅

I'm disappointed at how this forum is turning into XboxEra.

My thread privileges were removed because no one has a sense of humor anymore when it comes to gaming.

PlayStation is in inevitable decline, both quality & creatively.

Enjoy the shitshow that is the PS5/PC generation, weirdos.
No sense of humor? creating moronic threads is sense of humor?
 

Yurinka

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That folk is jerking off.

I think as always Sony will just focus the showcase (which I think will be early June) on marketing the main games of their console to be releasaed in mostly the next 6-9 months or so (the rest of FY), maximum a year and a half or two.

With maybe a single exception or two of an announcement teaser of something to be releasaed beyond that.
 

Yurinka

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  • They also bought 1.93 percent of Kadokawa
    • These smaller strategic investments are often about deepening relationships and creating collaborations that lead to acquisitions
Just a small correction: Sony didn't bought this. Kadokawa gave almost 2% to Sony and almost 2% to CyberAgent (CyGames's parent company, leading mobile gaming company in Japan) as part of a 3 ways deal where in exchange Sony would help to bring Kadokawa IPs to the global audience via console gaming and anime, and Cyberagent would to it via mobile gaming.

  • Bloomberg and others report that Sony is looking to buy MechaComics for 1.3 billion
    • MechaComic is a distributor of manga they don't create manga
Very interesting, I didn't know this. If true, it means Sony would be interested on distribute comics -manga in this case- digitally, I assume via Crunchyroll.

This indirectly means that Japanese gaming companies with a manga business / catalog now would be more appealing to be acquired for Sony, something that without this could be an issue instead.

Particularly, this points Sony's sniper rifle to Kadokawa's face since they are one of the biggest manga, book magazines publishers of Japan.

It also would make Bandai Namco (Japan's top grossing 3rd party publisher) more interesting for them because of their experience adapting manga / anime IPs to gaming and well, also owning "Bandai Namco Filmworks" (formerly known as Sunrise, the ones from Cowboy Bebop, Gundam, Digimon among many others).

And well, in a way less smaller scale Square Enix also has a manga business, so it would make a potential acquisition more fitting.

  • Tencent already owns a large percentage of FromSoftware about 15 or 16 percent, it may be significantly easier to buy Kadokawa to push them out, and there are some synergies making buying Kadokawa make sense
Small note regarading Tencent having acquired a minority of X or Y company: they do it as investment, doesn't mean they plan to acquire the company or to keep them away from others.

If the company (in this case FromSoft or Kadokawa) wants to be sold to someone else as could be Sony, if Sony pays whatever Tencent considers it would be a good deal, Tencent will sell them.

Not only that, they'd wish them good luck and would even offer them some deal to help them in China. But well, in this case Kadokawa and Sony already have a deal with Tencent to be supported by them in China.

The proposed bid was 26 billion. 50+1 would be at least 13 billion, more than the entire M&A budget listed including the stock buybacks AND the music catalog acquisitions.
We also have to remember Sony aren't the only ones in this offer. Their partner in the offer (I think it was Apollo) would pay a part of it, pretty likely would pay the part that Sony can't acquire, the US line tv stuff.

Meaning, Sony would pay way less than these $26B/$13B. But that would be only the acquisition. You need to add on top of that the costs related to the acquisitions (retention bonuses, restructuring costs, etc) plus paying their big debt.

Regarding budget, Sony pretty likely considers to pay a good chunk of this acquisition with the around $10B they had budgeted for the previous 3 years period to be spend ton the Zee acquisition that failed.
 
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Yurinka

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View attachment 5129
Just look at how much of their capital is going to shareholder returns. It's clearly the largest or 2nd largest bloc on their investment allocation. That's what they're focused on.
It's worth mentioning that in addition to this there's the around $10B allocated to Sony Pictures for the Zee acquisition in the previous mid-term plan that weren't spent.

Meaning, pretty likely Sony Pictures pretty likely will spend them on the Paramount acquisition or something else.

It's also worth mentioning that they said that the share buyback and shareholder returns will be flexible (this is the reason of why they don't have any number on their forecast).

One of the journalist should’ve ask if PS consider PC a direct competitor per Jim Ryan why is PS porting games & diminishing its platform & storefront to benefit a direct competitor & make there competitors become more defacto in gaming. What’s the strategy? Is it short term profits at the cost of making competitors greater platform & storefront for gaming? Because that’s what there doing w these PC port.

Not even Steam, Apple, Nintendo, Netflix or Disney does self cannibalizing to its platform & storefront & find other means to expand ip or bring more profits that don’t have negative effects or short term upside for medium to long term damages
Sony already explained it. AAA are becoming too expensive to be profitable only in their own platform even if they continue growing their console hardware and first party revenue at record numbers, so they need extra revenue channels.

On top of this, PC gaming is a way bigger market than the PlayStation one and has a pretty small overlap with PlayStation. Plus the PC ports proven to be a very successful and profitable investment with a huge CAGR growth and also proved to have zero negative effect in their console business, which continues growing in all areas and breaking many records. Even the sequels of the ported games sold the same or in most cases better in console than the ported games.

And in addition to this, PC is specially popular in most of the biggest and fastest countries in the world (China, India, Korea, LATAM, Middle East, some other Asian countries), where consoles have a small presence.

So they plan to use PC, in addition to mobile and movies/tv show adaptations, plus partnerships with local companies, to grow their presence in these countries.

To stick to non-GaaS games and/or to stick to console only first party games would mean they would need to stop making first party games outside their few top selling games. Because this gen AAA games will cost them over $300M, which means it would need to sell over $9M copies to be profitable and most past Sony first party games didn't sell that.

And in the next gen the costs as every generation will rise, so the sales needed for non-GaaS AAA titles to be profitable will be even higher. It's a long term growth strategy, not a short term one.

They care about growing their revenue, profit and userbase reducing risks. Not about a whiny fanboy who cries because people in other platforms can also play Sony games.
 
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mibu no ookami

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Just a small correction: Sony didn't bought this. Kadokawa gave almost 2% to Sony and almost 2% to CyberAgent (CyGames's parent company, leading mobile gaming company in Japan) as part of a 3 ways deal where in exchange Sony would help to bring Kadokawa IPs to the global audience via console gaming and anime, and Cyberagent would to it via mobile gaming.

This is not true. When you go to correct someone please make sure you know what you're talking about.

Sony takes 1.9% stake in From Software’s parent company

“We believe that it is necessary to procure such funds in order not to miss potential investment opportunities and to solidify our ability to create IP based on our track record of creating rich and unique IP consisting of a diverse portfolio of books, movies, animations, games, and UGC platforms, both financially and financially,” it said.

Very interesting, I didn't know this. If true, it means Sony would be interested on distribute comics -manga in this case- digitally, I assume via Crunchyroll.

This indirectly means that Japanese gaming companies with a manga business / catalog now would be more appealing to be acquired for Sony, something that without this could be an issue instead.

Particularly, this points Sony's sniper rifle to Kadokawa's face since they are one of the biggest manga, book magazines publishers of Japan.

It also would make Bandai Namco (Japan's top grossing 3rd party publisher) more interesting for them because of their experience adapting manga / anime IPs to gaming and well, also owning "Bandai Namco Filmworks" (formerly known as Sunrise, the ones from Cowboy Bebop, Gundam, Digimon among many others).

And well, in a way less smaller scale Square Enix also has a manga business, so it would make a potential acquisition more fitting.

Sony Group, others eyeing buyout of Infocom, Bloomberg News reports

Kadokawa makes sense. Namco Bandai would be considerably more expensive. Square enix still doesn't make sense.

Namco Bandai makes a lot more sense than Square Enix and if they buy Kadokawa, they actually make way more sense in the future. You not only get access to a lot of IP and studios, but you also bolster anime/manga, and Namco Bandai probably has a more storied history with Sony than Square Enix, with Ridge Racer, Tekken, Ace Combat. You'd also get the rights to Dark Souls.

Small note regarading Tencent having acquired a minority of X or Y company: they do it as investment, doesn't mean they plan to acquire the company or to keep them away from others.

Where did I say Tencent was going to acquire anyone. That being said, they easily could.
If the company (in this case FromSoft or Kadokawa) wants to be sold to someone else as could be Sony, if Sony pays whatever Tencent considers it would be a good deal, Tencent will sell them.

Tencent doesn't have enough ownership to decide what a good deal is or not...

We also have to remember Sony aren't the only ones in this offer. Their partner in the offer (I think it was Apollo) would pay a part of it, pretty likely would pay the part that Sony can't acquire, the US line tv stuff.

Sony can't own CBS, that has nothing to do with the rest of the networks. Also all reports suggest that Sony will have an option to buy Apollo out in the future and the plan is likely to sell all of the tv broadcast and networks.

Meaning, Sony would pay way less than these $26B/$13B. But that would be only the acquisition. You need to add on top of that the costs related to the acquisitions (retention bonuses, restructuring costs, etc) plus paying their big debt.

They're immediately going to do layoffs, there won't be much additional costs outside of normal operations and integration.

The debt was part of the deal, which hasn't even been finalized. It. could become more narrowly focused.

Regarding budget, Sony pretty likely considers to pay a good chunk of this acquisition with the around $10B they had budgeted for the previous 3 years period to be spend ton the Zee acquisition that failed.

Zee was not a cash deal... you continue to discuss things that you're not familiar with...
 

mibu no ookami

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It's worth mentioning that in addition to this there's the around $10B allocated to Sony Pictures for the Zee acquisition in the previous mid-term plan that weren't spent.

Meaning, pretty likely Sony Pictures pretty likely will spend them on the Paramount acquisition or something else.

It's also worth mentioning that they said that the share buyback and shareholder returns will be flexible (this is the reason of why they don't have any number on their forecast).


Sony already explained it. AAA are becoming too expensive to be profitable only in their own platform even if they continue growing their console hardware and first party revenue at record numbers, so they need extra revenue channels.

On top of this, PC gaming is a way bigger market than the PlayStation one and has a pretty small overlap with PlayStation. And in addition to this, PC is specially popular in most of the biggest and fastest countries in the world (China, India, Korea, LATAM, Middle East, some other Asian countries), where consoles have a small presence.

So they plan to use PC, in addition to mobile and movies/tv show adaptations, plus partnerships with local companies, to grow their presence in these countries.

See above. Zee was not a cash deal.
 

Darth Vader

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This is not true. When you go to correct someone please make sure you know what you're talking about.

Sony takes 1.9% stake in From Software’s parent company





Sony Group, others eyeing buyout of Infocom, Bloomberg News reports

Kadokawa makes sense. Namco Bandai would be considerably more expensive. Square enix still doesn't make sense.

Namco Bandai makes a lot more sense than Square Enix and if they buy Kadokawa, they actually make way more sense in the future. You not only get access to a lot of IP and studios, but you also bolster anime/manga, and Namco Bandai probably has a more storied history with Sony than Square Enix, with Ridge Racer, Tekken, Ace Combat. You'd also get the rights to Dark Souls.



Where did I say Tencent was going to acquire anyone. That being said, they easily could.


Tencent doesn't have enough ownership to decide what a good deal is or not...



Sony can't own CBS, that has nothing to do with the rest of the networks. Also all reports suggest that Sony will have an option to buy Apollo out in the future and the plan is likely to sell all of the tv broadcast and networks.



They're immediately going to do layoffs, there won't be much additional costs outside of normal operations and integration.

The debt was part of the deal, which hasn't even been finalized. It. could become more narrowly focused.



Zee was not a cash deal... you continue to discuss things that you're not familiar with...
This is one of the reasons why I still visit this forum.

wrestlemania xii wrestling GIF by WWE
 

Yurinka

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This is not true. When you go to correct someone please make sure you know what you're talking about.

Sony takes 1.9% stake in From Software’s parent company
Wtf did you smoke? Shut up, What I said is true and nothing in that article proves me wrong.

Kadokadokawa's deal works as I said, as can be seen in the image screencapped in the article:
Capture.jpg


Here you have the details of the deal, including how Kadokawa gave exactly the same amount of Kadokawa shares to Sony and CyberAgent as part of the deal.

This is the important part of the document ("CA" = Cyber Agent, "the company" = Kadokawa):

image.png


"Please make sure you know what you're talking about." xDD

Sony Group, others eyeing buyout of Infocom, Bloomberg News reports

Kadokawa makes sense. Namco Bandai would be considerably more expensive. Square enix still doesn't make sense.

Namco Bandai makes a lot more sense than Square Enix and if they buy Kadokawa, they actually make way more sense in the future. You not only get access to a lot of IP and studios, but you also bolster anime/manga, and Namco Bandai probably has a more storied history with Sony than Square Enix, with Ridge Racer, Tekken, Ace Combat. You'd also get the rights to Dark Souls.
Yes, I think Bandai Namco would be too expensive to be bought in this mid term period considering the budget. Kadokawa could be done regarding pricing but still not sure if they would want to sell and if Sony would be happy with their other businesses that don't fit Sony business segments (I personally would).

Regarding Square, I think Sony won't acquire it but instead will acquire (probably a minority of) some of their studios once, as Square Enix said will do, spinoff them as subsidiary companies to allow inverstors to invest only on specific areas of the company.

This would help Sony not only invest in/secure only in the SE areas they are interested in, but also to reduce the amount of money to pay and to skip any possible issue with market regulators.

Where did I say Tencent was going to acquire anyone.
I didn't say you mentioned it, it was just a comment.

Tencent doesn't have enough ownership to decide what a good deal is or not...
I was talking about Tencent's stake, not the company.

Meaning, if Tencent owns a 13% Sony can make a specific offer to Tencent to buy them that 13%. Tencent can decide if that deal is good enough or not.

Sony can't own CBS, that has nothing to do with the rest of the networks.
I didn't say that Sony can't buy the other networks.

Also all reports suggest that Sony will have an option to buy Apollo out in the future and the plan is likely to sell all of the tv broadcast and networks.
Yes, apparently the idea is that Sony would buy them later part of the stuff.

They're immediately going to do layoffs, there won't be much additional costs outside of normal operations and integration.
Yes, but they have a gazillion companies that will need an integration process, new offices, and a ton of key individuals who will get retention bonuses, services that pretty likely will be restructured or merged in other ones.

In case of Bungie it was over a billon, here would be more.

The debt was part of the deal, which hasn't even been finalized. It. could become more narrowly focused.
Yes, obviously is part of the deal: whoever buys the company (in this case for $26B if they would have accepted the rumored initial offer) also gets the debt.

Sony will pretty likely will get part of it and other part will go to Apollo, and Sony pretty likely will be able to reduce it refinancing it. But still will have to pay a big chunk of that debt (but not this year).

Zee was not a cash deal... you continue to discuss things that you're not familiar with...
I didn't say it was cash, I said Sony had budgeted to spend there around $10B on Zee (can't remember the specific number) in the previous mid-term plan and these $10B aren't included in the current budget, meaning they continue assigned.

And who cares if they were paying it with cash or shares, if needed Sony could sell these Sony shares to get cash, or use the shareback program or whatever. There's a million things they can do to pay an acquisition with their cash, shares, etc.

The important thing here is that Sony Pictures had approved to pay around $10B in the previous period, didn't do it and they didn't put the money in the budget, meaning Sony Pictures still plans to spend it (obviously as part of the Paramount deal if they end completing it).

And please stop talking like an entitled childish moron with that stupid "to discuss things that you're not familiar with..."
 
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Nhomnhom

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Can't wait to hear more about their PC strategy, how they have 40 quadrillion games in development. This "keynote" has the potential to make or break the future of PS as we know it.
PC is their key to profitability, ports apparently don't cost them anything and piracy doesn't bother them.

Meanwhile they can't invest on a PS3 emulator or even patch games for PlayStation players.

All their games being available on PC, with free online and free cloud saving somehow helps PlayStation.
 

mibu no ookami

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Wtf did you smoke? Shut up, What I said is true and nothing in that article proves me wrong.

Kadokadokawa's deal works as I said, as can be seen in the image screencapped in the article:
Capture.jpg


Here you have the details of the deal, including how Kadokawa gave exactly the same amount of Kadokawa shares to Sony and CyberAgent as part of the deal.

This is the important part of the document ("CA" = Cyber Agent, "the company" = Kadokawa):

image.png


"Please make sure you know what you're talking about." xDD

Yes, you do in fact continue to not know what you're talking about. Maybe it's because you're not a native English speaker, but there's no excuse for it.

They specifically said and I bolded for you, that they received funds as part of the deal. Somehow you think because the deal came as part of a collaboration that no money was exchanged, but they've stated that it was.

Yes, I think Bandai Namco would be too expensive to be bought in this mid term period considering the budget. Kadokawa could be done regarding pricing but still not sure if they would want to sell and if Sony would be happy with their other businesses that don't fit Sony business segments (I personally would).

You don't understand how companies get bought and sold. Kadokawa is a publicly shared company. If Sony makes an offer the board may have a fiduciary responsibility to bring the offer to shareholders. If enough shareholders vote to sell, the company will be sold. It's not like leadership just decides we do or don't want to be bought.

Crunchyroll is owned by a joint venture between Sony Music Via Aniplex and Sony Pictures. If they take up publication and distribution of manga, it'll simply roll through there. It's not enough to become a new segment. Though one day it might, if sony decides to split Anime/Manga into its own thing. Sony Computer Entertainment was created by a joint venture of sony and sony music before being eventually spun into its own under sony.

Regarding Square, I think Sony won't acquire it but instead will acquire (probably a minority of) some of their studios once, as Square Enix said will do, spinoff them as subsidiary companies to allow inverstors to invest only on specific areas of the company.

This would help Sony not only invest in/secure only in the SE areas they are interested in, but also to reduce the amount of money to pay and to skip any possible issue with market regulators.

You're only saying that because you saw an article where square enix was toying with the idea of selling stake in its studios. That doesn't mean Sony would be interested in owning stake. There would be no regulatory concerns if sony wanted to buy square enix out right and I see no reason why Sony would want ownership of any of Square's studios.

I didn't say you mentioned it, it was just a comment.


I was talking about Tencent's stake, not the company.

Meaning, if Tencent owns a 13% Sony can make a specific offer to Tencent to buy them that 13%. Tencent can decide if that deal is good enough or not.

Then you're just stating the obvious.

I didn't say that Sony can't buy the other networks.

You said us line tv stuff, which strongly implies the networks. If you understand it was just CBS, you would have just said CBS. Stuff is a plural.

Yes, apparently the idea is that Sony would buy them later part of the stuff.


Yes, but they have a gazillion companies that will need an integration process, new offices, and a ton of key individuals who will get retention bonuses, services that pretty likely will be restructured or merged in other ones.

None of this is true. They absolutely wouldn't need new offices and would largely work as an independent label distributed through Sony Pictures. All aspects of distribution through Paramount would be shut down. There's no real need for retention bonuses either. This isn't like game development. Sony already has the full capacity for film production here. What Sony is buying is largely the IP and rights to IP NOT people. This is not like the Bungie deal.

In case of Bungie it was over a billon, here would be more.

Again, this isn't the bungie deal. Sony isn't buying people and talent. They're buying IP and scale.
Yes, obviously is part of the deal: whoever buys the company (in this case for $26B if they would have accepted the rumored initial offer) also gets the debt.

What you don't understand is that the initial offer of the 26 billion includes the debt. They have about 16 billion in debt, the initial deal would be to pay off that debt, so the actual deal itself is only for about 10 billion.


I didn't say it was cash, I said Sony had budgeted to spend there around $10B on Zee (can't remember the specific number) in the previous mid-term plan and these $10B aren't included in the current budget, meaning they continue assigned.

"budgeted to spend around 10 billion"

Except they weren't spending anything. It was a joint venture with Zee that was going to be worth 10 billion. Sony was going to own 51 percent of the combined company which would be a new company after combining Sony Pictures India with Zee creating Culver Max.

The only thing "budgeted" from Sony would have been a 1.5 billion dollar cash infusion into the company, earning it the majority share.

And who cares if they were paying it with cash or shares, if needed Sony could sell these Sony shares to get cash, or use the shareback program or whatever. There's a million things they can do to pay an acquisition with their cash, shares, etc.

And please stop talking like an entitled childish moron with that stupid "to discuss things that you're not familiar with..."

But you don't know what you're talking about. Sony doesn't have this 10 billion dollars lying around to spend elsewhere, because they were never spending 10 billion. They have 1.5 billion that they were going to inject into the new business that they can spend elsewhere, but they won't do that until the courts deny Zee remediation.
 

Yurinka

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Yes, you do in fact continue to not know what you're talking about. Maybe it's because you're not a native English speaker, but there's no excuse for it.

They specifically said and I bolded for you, that they received funds as part of the deal. Somehow you think because the deal came as part of a collaboration that no money was exchanged, but they've stated that it was.
What a pile of flatearther bullshit. The document is very clear, Sony didn't pay anything to Kadokawa, didn't receive any money from them.

Kadokawa issued new shares and gave them to Sony and CyberAgent via 3rd party allotment to pay their work helping Kadokawa to bringing Kadokawa IPs to a global market with Sony's help in case of consumer games and anime and CyberAgent's help in case of mobile games.

You don't understand how companies get bought and sold. Kadokawa is a publicly shared company. If Sony makes an offer the board may have a fiduciary responsibility to bring the offer to shareholders. If enough shareholders vote to sell, the company will be sold. It's not like leadership just decides we do or don't want to be bought.
This has nothing to do with what I said.

I said that if Sony wants to buy Tencent's minority will make an offer to Tencent because is who owns it, so only Tencent decides if they sell that stake or not. And in case they are open to sell, they negotiate a price.

This is not the same than if Sony makes an offer to buy the whole Kadokawa, in this case as you say they'd make an offer to the board, who would inform all the shareholders and whoever has voting rights will vote.

You're only saying that because you saw an article where square enix was toying with the idea of selling stake in its studios. That doesn't mean Sony would be interested in owning stake.
True. Well, not exactly. I didn't read an article, I did read it from Square when explained it to the investors. And I assumed that this was made specifically for Sony and Tencent.

There would be no regulatory concerns if sony wanted to buy square enix out right and I see no reason why Sony would want ownership of any of Square's studios.
MS had regulatory issues with the ABK aquisition, when they together own a way smaller market share than Sony+SE.

Sony already is the market leader of console gaming, console game subs and depending on the quarter or year also of the whole gaming. So obviously market regulators are going to be more strict and more likely to stop the acquisition than in the ABK case because Sony has way more market power and could act as gatekeeper and basically could help most JRPG sales for themselves since SE pretty much dominates the sales of that genre.

You said us line tv stuff, which strongly implies the networks.
No, it doesn't. Many of these networks are in cable tv or IPTV specially outside USA. In fact some of them aren't in USA. These can be sold to foreigners.

What can be sold is the big line tv, the old school broadcast one.

None of this is true. They absolutely wouldn't need new offices and would largely work as an independent label distributed through Sony Pictures. All aspects of distribution through Paramount would be shut down. There's no real need for retention bonuses either. This isn't like game development. Sony already has the full capacity for film production here. What Sony is buying is largely the IP and rights to IP NOT people. This is not like the Bungie deal.

Of course what I said it's true, happens in any decent acquisition.

It is obvious that if is very likely they'll have massive layoffs in some places, subsidiaries heavily downsized or merged with other ones will need new offices. Other ones will be shut down or sold. In some cases will need new smaller offices for the downsized ones, in other cases bigger ones for the merged ones.

And always there are retention bonuses to keep the key talent of the acquired company. I even signed that personally one of the times our studio was bought, and was a tiny company, and wasn't in the top level of the company. So obviously in a huge company like Paramount which has several key teams and subsidiaries there will be many key talent that Sony would want to secure at least during a few years.

As an example, if they acquire Comedy Central and Southpark they will want to make sure they keep there the key people running Comedy Central and Southpark to keep rolling it.

Again, this isn't the bungie deal. Sony isn't buying people and talent. They're buying IP and scale.
What a nonsensical take. Of course they are buying talent, they are buying the fucking Paramount Group, which includes a ton of teams. These movies, tv shows, channels, music, services, etc. aren't made and run by magic faires.

These $30B/year don't grow in trees. There are talented and experienced individuals generating them with their successful job. Paramount Global has over 20K employees. I assume some thousands will be fired before and after the acquisition because in case of Sony many of them wouldn't be needed due to .

What you don't understand is that the initial offer of the 26 billion includes the debt. They have about 16 billion in debt, the initial deal would be to pay off that debt, so the actual deal itself is only for about 10 billion.
I won't repeat it, I explained it multiple times.

"budgeted to spend around 10 billion"

Except they weren't spending anything. It was a joint venture with Zee that was going to be worth 10 billion. Sony was going to own 51 percent of the combined company which would be a new company after combining Sony Pictures India with Zee creating Culver Max.

The only thing "budgeted" from Sony would have been a 1.5 billion dollar cash infusion into the company, earning it the majority share.

But you don't know what you're talking about. Sony doesn't have this 10 billion dollars lying around to spend elsewhere, because they were never spending 10 billion. They have 1.5 billion that they were going to inject into the new business that they can spend elsewhere, but they won't do that until the courts deny Zee remediation.
The $10B of the value of the merger aren't the around $10B I mentioned, of which $1.5B were the infusion.

I'm talking about Sony's plan to highly grow in the Indian market that would have been done via the entity resulting from that merger (which in reality would be basically an aquisition) investing there around $10B (can't remember the exact amount). I don't remember the details, involved Indian movies, tv channels, services which I'm not sure if were already on Sony's Indian arm, in Zee's part or if they planned to also aquired them and put it there, produce them one they had the merger done or whatever else.

I didn't took much attention other than knowing that Sony expected to merge with/acquire the Indian giant Zee and grow in the Indian movie/tv/music business with an investment of around $10B because the Indian market makes a lot of money and specially has a lot of growth.

I don't remember, maybe you're right and I'm wrong.

^^^^^

Not the two Chat G*T accounts disagreeing with each other in this thread 😂
I don't know about you but my bet is on yurinka, I think he will whittle down ookami with 5000 word long posts in this war of attrition
Fuck you all, assholes. xDDD
 

mibu no ookami

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What a pile of flatearther bullshit. The document is very clear, Sony didn't pay anything to Kadokawa, didn't receive any money from them.

Kadokawa issued new shares and gave them to Sony and CyberAgent via 3rd party allotment to pay their work helping Kadokawa to bringing Kadokawa IPs to a global market with Sony's help in case of consumer games and anime and CyberAgent's help in case of mobile games.

They specifically said they received funds. You want to ignore that because it flies in the face of what you're saying.

This has nothing to do with what I said.

I said that if Sony wants to buy Tencent's minority will make an offer to Tencent because is who owns it, so only Tencent decides if they sell that stake or not. And in case they are open to sell, they negotiate a price.

This is not the same than if Sony makes an offer to buy the whole Kadokawa, in this case as you say they'd make an offer to the board, who would inform all the shareholders and whoever has voting rights will vote.

If Sony bought FromSoftware from Kadokawa, they could force Tencent out of their ownership. Same if Sony bought Kadokawa. Sony doesn't need to buy shares directly from Tencent, the only reason they would do so is if they were trying to leverage the additional voting shares assuming they are voting shares in order to influence a buyout vote.

True. Well, not exactly. I didn't read an article, I did read it from Square when explained it to the investors. And I assumed that this was made specifically for Sony and Tencent.

An assumption based on pretty much nothing. Maybe Tencent would be interested, but it would largely depend on how that studio was then compensated for their sales. It's not a common situation. These are not publicly traded assets and as such they don't inherently increase in value and those shares don't have value until sold. It's essentially a funding round.

If Kadokawa was to ever sell FromSoftware for X dollars, Sony would get 14.9% or whatever it was that they had from that sale. There is likely no dividend involved.

MS had regulatory issues with the ABK aquisition, when they together own a way smaller market share than Sony+SE.

Sony already is the market leader of console gaming, console game subs and depending on the quarter or year also of the whole gaming. So obviously market regulators are going to be more strict and more likely to stop the acquisition than in the ABK case because Sony has way more market power and could act as gatekeeper and basically could help most JRPG sales for themselves since SE pretty much dominates the sales of that genre.

It's clear that you don't understand the purpose of regulators. Global regulators don't care if Sony has a larger market share in JRPG. In the grand scheme of things, it's a niche market, it's not really even a market. At no point did any regulatory body say that Microsof would have too much control among FPS having Halo, Doom, Quake, Wolfenstein, Overwatch and CoD.

It's laughable that you think that regulators would have any concern over such a small percentage of an industry.

This is by far the most ridiculous thing you've said.

Sony just bought Crunchyroll despite already owning Funimation. They have massive market share when it comes to anime in the US and many other countries. No one even blinked an eye here. Again, I'm dying laughing at the suggestion that regulators would step in.

Regulators might step in if Sony tried to buy Nintendo, but short of that, they're not stepping in. Sony could buy EA or T2 and no one would care.

No, it doesn't. Many of these networks are in cable tv or IPTV specially outside USA. In fact some of them aren't in USA. These can be sold to foreigners.

What can be sold is the big line tv, the old school broadcast one.

You had no idea what CBS was or what the rules were, but thank you for catching up a bit.

Of course what I said it's true, happens in any decent acquisition.

It is obvious that if is very likely they'll have massive layoffs in some places, subsidiaries heavily downsized or merged with other ones will need new offices. Other ones will be shut down or sold. In some cases will need new smaller offices for the downsized ones, in other cases bigger ones for the merged ones.

And always there are retention bonuses to keep the key talent of the acquired company. I even signed that personally one of the times our studio was bought, and was a tiny company, and wasn't in the top level of the company. So obviously in a huge company like Paramount which has several key teams and subsidiaries there will be many key talent that Sony would want to secure at least during a few years.

No, there aren't always retention bonuses. It depends largely on the industry and the purpose for the purchase. Sony doesn't need the staff of Paramount Global. That's not why they're buying them. They want their assets. Paramount doesn't employ directors, actors, or writers. Everything that Paramount currently does to produce films, Sony can already do. These are the exact people who are facing layoffs. They're not getting retention bonuses.

You don't understand that different industries work differently. I worked for an asset management company that merged with another asset management company. We did the exact same things. Not only were there not retention bonuses, but normal bonuses were slashed with the hopes that people would go away on their own.

What key team do you think exists at Paramount?


As an example, if they acquire Comedy Central and Southpark they will want to make sure they keep there the key people running Comedy Central and Southpark to keep rolling it.


What a nonsensical take. Of course they are buying talent, they are buying the fucking Paramount Group, which includes a ton of teams. These movies, tv shows, channels, music, services, etc. aren't made and run by magic faires.

All reports suggest that they have no interest in retaining Comedy Central or the other networks. Nor would people in these positions get retention bonuses to stay. They don't need them to stay. They're largely going to be laid off.

These $30B/year don't grow in trees. There are talented and experienced individuals generating them with their successful job. Paramount Global has over 20K employees. I assume some thousands will be fired before and after the acquisition because in case of Sony many of them wouldn't be needed due to .

You don't even understand what Sony is interested in this case.

I won't repeat it, I explained it multiple times.


The $10B of the value of the merger aren't the around $10B I mentioned, of which $1.5B were the infusion.

I'm talking about Sony's plan to highly grow in the Indian market that would have been done via the entity resulting from that merger (which in reality would be basically an aquisition) investing there around $10B (can't remember the exact amount). I don't remember the details, involved Indian movies, tv channels, services which I'm not sure if were already on Sony's Indian arm, in Zee's part or if they planned to also aquired them and put it there, produce them one they had the merger done or whatever else.


You had no idea what you were talking about. You said that Sony budgeted 10 billion and they didn't. Just concede and do better in the future.

Zee was going to fold into Sony Pictures and they were going to establish a new company Culver Max which was going to be 51% owned by Sony Pictures and run by Zee's CEO. Sony was going to infuse 1.5 billion into the new company. The value of the company was going to be 10 billion dollars. There was no budget for 10 billion dollars.


I didn't took much attention other than knowing that Sony expected to merge with/acquire the Indian giant Zee and grow in the Indian movie/tv/music business with an investment of around $10B because the Indian market makes a lot of money and specially has a lot of growth.

I don't remember, maybe you're right and I'm wrong.

You are wrong, there is no maybe about it.
 

mibu no ookami

Veteran
21 Feb 2024
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I don't know about you but my bet is on yurinka, I think he will whittle down ookami with 5000 word long posts in this war of attrition

I mean I'll certainly stop responding at some point but I've already defeated him.

I mean anytime you argue with someone on the internet, you've already lost, but the guy just doesn't know what he is talking about.

PS, I don't use chatgpt to create my posts as yurinka does.