Horizon is owned by Sony
No, it really isn't. A game developed by a Playstation Studios is, by definition, a first party game. Guerrilla is a first party studio, Horizon is a first party IP.
You got it boss
We can only speculate, like I did.
Sony, no PC day and date til April 2027
- Thread starter Etifilio
- Start date
No it is not. Developer is irrelevant. IP owner is what matters.
So what is Bloodborne? Developed by FS.
And Metroid Dread? Developed by MercuryStream.
We all know Horizon is Sony. LEGO is LEGO.
The question is who owns LEGO Horizons.
You have games like Kingdom hearts which are developed by Square with Square characters too along with Disney characters.
Turns out Disney owns the entire IP.
Stellar Blade & RotR are not internally-developed 1P titles. Also in the case of Stellar Blade, Shift Up own the IP rights, not SIE/Sony.
The whole thing about Day 1 PC for non-GAAS is WRT 1P internally-developed games. LEGO Horizon may only be co-developed by Guerrilla, but Guerrilla is an internal 1P studio and LEGO Horizon is a non-GAAS with light "live service" features (online co-op, but I assume you can also play local co-op and if not..welp, that's a massive mistake on the dev's part considering a lot of kids are gonna have siblings and friends at home playing with them in person).
I don't think providing clarification on this particular aspect of things means "caring" about SIE's strategies as if obsessed with them. It's just a way of noting what is happening, speculating why it's happening, and extrapolating what might happen from here given what is already seemingly occurring.
you lot are now changing the definition of very well established terms.https://www.ign.com/wikis/the-gaming-dictionary/1st_Party (there's many more sources)
"Refers to a studio that is directly owned and operated by one of the console making publishers"
Also, Horizon is a Sony IP. This game is literally a first-party game using two different IPs.
Bloodborne is co-developed with Japan Studio and is a Sony IP. It's first party.
Second Party. Nowadays second party is not used and has been essentially merged into first party
There's no question, both own the IPs in that first-party game.
Wrong. Disney owns the Kingdom Hearts IP, not the Square characters.
Let's try this:
- Before Insomniac became a first-party studio, PS commissioned the creation of the Spider-Man game from them. The IP is Marvel's, the game was developed by a third-party insomniac, yet it was a first-party (or second-party if you'd prefer) game because it was commissioned by PS for their platform.
- When Insomniac became a first-party studio, Spider-Man games continued being first-party games
- The same applies to Ratchet and Clank
- Death Stranding is a first-party game despite KojiPro being third-party
https://www.ign.com/wikis/the-gaming-dictionary/1st_Party (there's many more sources)
"Refers to a studio that is directly owned and operated by one of the console making publishers"
Also, Horizon is a Sony IP. This game is literally a first-party game using two different IPs.
Bloodborne is co-developed with Japan Studio and is a Sony IP. It's first party.
Second Party. Nowadays second party is not used and has been essentially merged into first party
There's no question, both own the IPs in that first-party game.
Wrong. Disney owns the Kingdom Hearts IP, not the Square characters.
Let's try this:
- Before Insomniac became a first-party studio, PS commissioned the creation of the Spider-Man game from them. The IP is Marvel's, the game was developed by a third-party insomniac, yet it was a first-party (or second-party if you'd prefer) game because it was commissioned by PS for their platform.
- When Insomniac became a first-party studio, Spider-Man games continued being first-party games
- The same applies to Ratchet and Clank
- Death Stranding is a first-party game despite KojiPro being third-party
No one is changing the definition of anything.
I’m saying the developer of a game is irrelevant to what is a First Party game.
First party games in this are OWNED by Sony.
We all know Sony owns Horizon, Bloodborne. Who developed them is irrelevant.
Sony does not own the Spiderman game franchise. That’s why the games are called Marvels Spiderman NOT Sony’s Spiderman.
So it is not a First party Sony game irrespective of who developed or published it. Whether Insomniac were third party or first party.
Sony simply owns the rights to develop Spiderman games. 3 main games from the looks of it.
The question is how it works with LEGO Horizons. A game comprised of 2 IP owners.
Who truly calls the shots.
And again you're wrong. A game developed by a first party studio is by definition a first party game.
And yet they are first party games. Fascinating.
It's a first party game, period. This is the hottest take I've read here, I'm actually going to call some people to watch the circus. @JAHGamer @anonpuffs @thicc_girls_are_teh_best look at this.
Your notion of how business works is fascinating. This is not a "who calls the shots" scenario, this is what both companies believe is a mutually beneficial deal. Sony gets to use the LEGO IP and associate it with their brand, LEGO gets the same, both get a slice of the pie.
Nobody is calling any shots, they just agreed to a deal.
Yes look at this.
As though they are experts.
Does Sony own Spiderman?
No.
Then how the hell is it First Party if it isn’t a Sony IP.
Sony own the rights to develop and publish 3 main Spiderman games.
What happens if Marvel give the rights to Microsoft after that? Its a first party Microsoft game then?
I've explained how Spider-Man is a first party game, you didn't listen. Go read.
If marvel gives Xbox the rights then the new games become Xbox first party games, whilst the Playstation games continue being first party to PlayStation. This is very easy to grasp.
Edit: and if you want to go through the whole "only IP means first party", I hope you understand what the notion of having the exclusive exploration rights to an IP means.
First Party games - Owned by First Party. Sony in this case.
Developer and even Publisher are irrelevant.
Spiderman is NOT owned by Sony = Not First party.
Death Stranding is owned by Sony = First Party.
Yet developed by a third party and even published by a third party on PC.
Is MLB the Show first party and how did Microsoft get Sony to release on Xbox Gamepass and later the Switch. Developed and published by Sony.
Oh wait it is owned by MLB.
Same appllies to LEGO games. Who truly calls the shots on those games?
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First party games include games developed by platform holder owned dev teams using IP not their own. Examples: Marvel's Spider-man, Valve's DotA2.
What a load of nonsense. MLB the show is a first party game released in multiple platforms. You, like other, are coming up with new definitions to well established nomenclature just to try and win an argument you've lost quite a while back.
Yes I understand that Stellar Blade is not an owned IP. Regardless they are not going day & date with 'big' single player games.
One thing I want to point out in particular is Licensing deals can be very rough, they can end In termination with the licensor having to pay double digit millions of dollars.
Now if I'm purely speculating, it was Sonys desicion to launch this Day & Date on Switch to hit said requirements.
To explain to you how rough licensing can be:
It can cost a ton of money requiring sales target such as 6-7 million copies sold; on those requirements are further 20% cuts on every single sale, that go up to 40% revenue share on things like Collectors edition), further requiring an additive, which can be rough on its own.
So I'm guessing Sony decided to put the games on Switch, since there a heavy LEGO audience there.
But again, pure speculation, I'm sure they had a concrete decision which we just do not have access to, there an concrete decision to their PC ports as well, it must benefit them is some way or another.
Theres no new definition on my part.
It’s you and others who have the issue.
MLB is owned by MLB. Developed and published by Sony cause they have the RIGHTS to publish it.
MLB made Sony release on Gamepass or lose the rights.
They don’t own it so it not First party.
Same goes for Spiderman and LEGO.
Sony own the rights to publish 3
Main Spiderman games.
Stop equating these games developed through publishing rights with actual First Party IPs.
They are NOT the same.
Which is why the nonsense here about Astro Bot and others games going Multiplatform Day 1 is nonsense and doom mongering.
Stellar Blade is a normal 2nd party game, where I assume Sony decided to don't buy the IP probably to get a cheaper deal and because they were more insterested on getting into the Korean market and partering with them maybe with potential future mobile games in mind, to build a relationship.
Regarding Lego Horizon, I think SIE decided to experiment many things with it. One of them being to release a game of this type day one on PC and Switch. I assume both Sony and Lego did their market research and saw that the option they chosen was the most promising one for both sides.
I think both saw a potential goldmine here that could end in multiple Lego Horizon (plus other Lego adaptations of SIE IPs) games and non-games products with big sales, which could help both expand their markets.
I think MLB is a different case, where Sony didn't want to publish the game themselves in rival consoles, so MLB had to do it themselves. Also, Sony in recent times has been opening to new markets. Notice this time it's SIE/PS Studios who publishes it everywhere, so they should be more than fine with it, and maybe was even their idea to use Lego adaptations to throw trojan horses.
They develop it, therefore it's first party. Very well established terms in the industry
And those games are first party, especially now that they are developed by their own PS Studios.
I didn't say they were first party IPs, I said they were first party games. There's a difference, and you clearly know it because you just moved the goalpost.
This has nothing to do with the fact that games developed by or commissioned by PS Studios are, by definition, first party.
If you want to keep changing terminology that's all on you buddy, if it gives you comfort and makes you feel very smart even better.
If they aren’t First Party IPs they aren’t First Party Games.
Stop changing the whole definition of First Party which you ironically accused me of doing.
Hahaha this is absolutely hilarious
Happy to know you find it hilarious.
Says more about you than me.
I agree, finding your ignorance hilarious does certainly show that I am perfectly capable of laughing at the misinformed and willfully ignorant.