Why hasn’t Sony been able to create anything approaching the quality of a Zelda?

[Yurinka]

BoTW

Or do you mean a new IP?

BotW didn't have a single new idea. All the things they added in BotW to the Zelda formula were copied from other very successful and popular games.

We must be playing other games. Gameplay was second to story in GOW, TLOU2, GOT, etc.

If you're just talking about presentation, then yeah I agree.

The gameplay of these games was top tier.

 

[balrogboy]

BotW didn't have a single new idea. All the things they added in BotW to the Zelda formula was copied from other very successful games.


The gameplay of these games was top tier.

And they didnt even do it well. That is more aparent than ever after Elden Ring that, admitedly, did the same type of game but did it in a way where the entire world feels purposefull, enemy variety is quite expansive and there is a reason to explore other than fucking korok seeds.
I'm not even gonna say that BOTW is a bad game, its just empty and unoriginal.
Compare it to anything from sony and you have a by the numbers experience that does nothing new

 

[Killer_Sakoman]

Seriously guys, they’ve had 25 years and 127 “Zelda killers” later, they can’t seem to create anything even remotely close. From Dark Cloud to Horizon, it’s been fail after fail. It’s frankly pathetic at this point. Maybe it’s for the best they’re pretty much pulling out of Japan or else they’d be forced to commit ritual suicide.

Why do you even compare Horizon to Zelda?

 

[Kokoloko]

Also Nintendo hasn’t made anything like God of War, Ghost of Tsushima or anything Naughty Dog has made in the last 12 Years.

Zelda is special, so is Mario. But so are 1st party Playstation games. Neither can replicate each other at the moment it seems

 

[Sonyfan87]

BotW didn't have a single new idea. All the things they added in BotW to the Zelda formula were copied from other very successful and popular games.


The gameplay of these games was top tier.

They're just generic western Ubisoft style of games.

Playstation westernizing was a huge mistake.

 

[Falcs]

The day Nintendo makes something as powerful and beautiful as this

is the day theyll be as good as Sony

This scene was way better.

 

[Bryank75]

This scene was way better.

They are both good scenes, going for something different in both cases.

One doesn't invalidate the other IMO.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Nintendos is in a unique position where their IP are their primary brand. What you said is true, their franchises are so malleable because they dont really follow a set continuity or even have voice acting.

You want to make zelda about time travel? Go ahead. You want to make a Kirby game about a post apocalyptic world? Sure. You want to make Mario literally about anything? Coming right up.

A company like sony can’t really make The Last of Us into a cartoony platformer or racing game. Although they are learning how to expand their IP’, while they can’t stretch them as far as Nintendo’s stuff they can bring them to movies, mobile, board games and multiplayer, etc.

Nintendo is like Disney, where they can insert their characters into any particular situation and it will most likely work. Its probably why they haven’t been that quick to adapt their stuff into cartoon shows and movies until now.

They don’t want their characters getting typecast into any particular personality traits or stories. Mario, Kirby, Link, Pokemon trainer, Yoshi, are all heroes, thats their personality.

I think you hit the nail on the head WRT why Nintendo's stuff is so malleable: they don't tell hard-set stories. Nintendo's games are identified through their character designs, world designs, and very simple-but-effective aesthetics. Sony has a few IP that fit that bill (or potentially could), the ones that come to the top of my head are Parappa, Tomba!, and Astrobot. But two of those are dormant.

I think Little Big Planet might be another with that potential, they would need to do a bit more with it first though before we can say for certain. These are all IP that are visually unique enough but also simple enough in visual/aesthetic complexity to lend themselves well to a host of different genre types. They also are pretty light on story and the themes their stories operate on are very general/universal and family-friendly, so they don't lock the IP down into specific thematic templates or age categories.

 

[EbonyRainbow]

This scene was way better.

Yeah the helpless heroin crying on the hero’s shoulder BECAUSE SHE FAILED as if that hasn’t been done a billion times before. Its not new and its super cliche. What Sony did was exciting and brave and different. Whats new about the girl crying on the hero? I swear some of you Nintenbots will defend any graphically outdated game they charge you 60 dollars for

 

[Falcs]

Yeah the helpless heroin crying on the hero’s shoulder BECAUSE SHE FAILED as if that hasn’t been done a billion times before. Its not new and its super cliche. What Sony did was exciting and brave and different. Whats new about the girl crying on the hero? I swear some of you Nintenbots will defend any graphically outdated game they charge you 60 dollars for

Hey man you're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree.

I didn't find that scene you linked exciting at all. It was a boring domestic dispute. They were in a comfortable setting in a house, on a quiet night.
On the other hand, the BOTW scene had them running from literal extermination which makes for a much more exciting scene setting.
I also don't see what was so brave about the Ellie and Dina scene.

The heroin crying on the hero's shoulder has been done a billion times because it works. Something doesn't have to be new to be good.
The scene is far more relatable.
Everybody fails at several points in life. And most people want to provide comfort to those they love. You can easily relate to both characters.
I can't say that I relate to Ellie wanting to leave her loved ones to go and get revenge.

Also neither the games graphics nor its cost have anything to do with the impact of the scene.

 

[RE4-City]

If you asked this question 20 years ago I might of agreed with you as Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, and Wind Waker (And Twilight Princess but that was only 16 years ago.) were like nothing else at the time despite the latter two getting a bit of flake at release because of the 3 day system in Majora and the Cel Shading Graphics in Wind Waker but I would argue since the middle of the 7th gen Sony's Games were head and shoulders above anything Nintendo did including Zelda. I Got a PS4 in the summer of 2018 was eye opening playing games like Horizon, Astrobot, God of War 2018, Gravity Rush 2, and The Last Gaurdian (which was Eiji Aonuma's goty 2016), Spider-Man, and Uncharted 4 all for the first time was really eye opening on how much of a jump Sony's first party input was compared to what I was playing on Wii U and Xbox one at the even compared to what Sony was doing during the PS3 era.

 

[EbonyRainbow]

Hey man you're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree.

I didn't find that scene you linked exciting at all. It was a boring domestic dispute. They were in a comfortable setting in a house, on a quiet night.
On the other hand, the BOTW scene had them running from literal extermination which makes for a much more exciting scene setting.
I also don't see what was so brave about the Ellie and Dina scene.

The heroin crying on the hero's shoulder has been done a billion times because it works. Something doesn't have to be new to be good.
The scene is far more relatable.
Everybody fails at several points in life. And most people want to provide comfort to those they love. You can easily relate to both characters.
I can't say that I relate to Ellie wanting to leave her loved ones to go and get revenge.

Also neither the games graphics nor its cost have anything to do with the impact of the scene.

Excuse me, my pronouns are on my tag I do not appreciate being called a “man”. Oh yeah a giant pig called “calamity ganon” is so horrifying. It’s the same story as every legend of zelda before. It was new and exciting the first time they did it not the 12th (I think) time. If we were talking about Ocarina of Time 20 years ago then maybe I’d would agree with you. Ellie was devastated because she lost her father figure and decided to risk everything she had for what she thought was what was right. She risked and lost everything and of course you can’t relate that’s what makes it brave and different. How can you relate to a character who always felt alone until she found a father figure in a post apocalypse world only to lose him so you risk the other person you love to avenge them. I hope you enjoy the breath of the wild 2. The plot is likey going to involve a evil pig and Link saving Zelda for the 1000th time.

 

[RE4-City]

Excuse me, my pronouns are on my tag I do not appreciate being called a “man”. Oh yeah a giant pig called “calamity ganon” is so horrifying. It’s the same story as every legend of zelda before. It was new and exciting the first time they did it not the 12th (I think) time. If we were talking about Ocarina of Time 20 years ago then maybe I’d would agree with you. Ellie was devastated because she lost her father figure and decided to risk everything she had for what she thought was what was right. She risked and lost everything and of course you can’t relate that’s what makes it brave and different. How can you relate to a character who always felt alone until she found a father figure in a post apocalypse world only to lose him so you risk the other person you love to avenge them. I hope you enjoy the breath of the wild 2. The plot is likey going to involve a evil pig and Link saving Zelda for the 1000th time.

I disagree, The story in BOTW is not the same story as previous Zelda's it's way worse then the previous ones in my opinion!

 

[Deleted member 13]

If you asked this question 20 years ago I might of agreed with you as Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, and Wind Waker (And Twilight Princess but that was only 16 years ago.) were like nothing else at the time despite the latter two getting a bit of flake at release because of the 3 day system in Majora and the Cel Shading Graphics in Wind Waker but I would argue since the middle of the 7th gen Sony's Games were head and shoulders above anything Nintendo did including Zelda. I Got a PS4 in the summer of 2018 was eye opening playing games like Horizon, Astrobot, God of War 2018, Gravity Rush 2, and The Last Gaurdian (which was Eiji Aonuma's goty 2016), Spider-Man, and Uncharted 4 all for the first time was really eye opening on how much of a jump Sony's first party input was compared to what I was playing on Wii U and Xbox one at the even compared to what Sony was doing during the PS3 era.

I agree here. I have always preferred Sony games over Nintendo. I think Nintendo is extremely niche platform for specific set of people. If you take away Zelda, what else would make it stand out. There will always be toddlers around so Nintendo will always have a place in the gaming society, but to me, Sony reaches a much wider audience with it's more mature games.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

I agree here. I have always preferred Sony games over Nintendo. I think Nintendo is extremely niche platform for specific set of people. If you take away Zelda, what else would make it stand out. There will always be toddlers around so Nintendo will always have a place in the gaming society, but to me, Sony reaches a much wider audience with it's more mature games.

Exactly that. I don't mind a toddler game like Astrobot, Sackboy Adventure as a "side" dish. But main course should be something aimed at mature audience.

 

[Muddasar]

Excuse me, my pronouns are on my tag I do not appreciate being called a “man”. Oh yeah a giant pig called “calamity ganon” is so horrifying. It’s the same story as every legend of zelda before. It was new and exciting the first time they did it not the 12th (I think) time. If we were talking about Ocarina of Time 20 years ago then maybe I’d would agree with you. Ellie was devastated because she lost her father figure and decided to risk everything she had for what she thought was what was right. She risked and lost everything and of course you can’t relate that’s what makes it brave and different. How can you relate to a character who always felt alone until she found a father figure in a post apocalypse world only to lose him so you risk the other person you love to avenge them. I hope you enjoy the breath of the wild 2. The plot is likey going to involve a evil pig and Link saving Zelda for the 1000th time.

Completely agree.

Like I mentioned earlier. Zelda is the same regurgitated story of saving Zelda from Ganon with a new reincarnated Link.

Yet people don't complain cause it's Nintendo.

 

[balrogboy]

Completely agree.

Like I mentioned earlier. Zelda is the same regurgitated story of saving Zelda from Ganon with a new reincarnated Link.

Yet people don't complain cause it's Nintendo.

I mean, to be 100% fair zelda never really was about the story, yes in some games story is a huge part of it but the very concept of the games cames from the creator exploring caves in his childhood or something like that.
People dont complain because that would be like complaining about minecraft's story, its just not the point. The story is there just as a means to an end.

 

[Muddasar]

I mean, to be 100% fair zelda never really was about the story, yes in some games story is a huge part of it but the very concept of the games cames from the creator exploring caves in his childhood or something like that.
People dont complain because that would be like complaining about minecraft's story, its just not the point. The story is there just as a means to an end.

Fair point but what little story it does have is the same.

I mean come on Nintendo, change it a little.

Nintendo know they can get away with it because they play with peoples nostalgia.

Next Mario will come along with Mario saving Princess Peach from Bowser.

 

[Swolf712]

Seriously guys, they’ve had 25 years and 127 “Zelda killers” later, they can’t seem to create anything even remotely close. From Dark Cloud to Horizon, it’s been fail after fail. It’s frankly pathetic at this point. Maybe it’s for the best they’re pretty much pulling out of Japan or else they’d be forced to commit ritual suicide.

That's kind of an extremely subjective and loaded question though. Zelda games are pretty varied in their type and quality as well, and I'd say they've definitely made games that far and away exceed the quality of a lot or even most of the Zelda entires.

I'm also a little confused about the idea of there ever being some sort of Franchise "Killer". Does that mean that one franchise isn't competing if the other somehow manages to keep going? Is success solely determined by effectively ending the other franchise? Idk, just seems more like a fanboy marketing concept than anything else.

 

[Nym]

I just watched an ICO speedrun yesterday, that's my favourite Sony game that is evocative of Zelda.