Microsoft: Xbox mid-gen refresh devices (FTC documents "leak")

Eternal_Wings

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I don’t think it will be a 100% copy of the Dualsense. As it’s reading it doesn’t have all functions the Dualsense have. Because if they would try to do an exactly copy of Dualsense, Sony would sue them. Everyone who wants a cheap copy can go ahead. I will stick to the Original.
 
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historia

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Upgrades can remove features...

But talking about PS4 Slim upgrade: APU (die shrink to 16nm), Dual-Band WiFi, 1TF HDD from what I remember.
It lose the AUX port (Optical port).
It is not an upgrade. It is a cheapened model to sell at lower price.

Also if I not mistaken PS4 Slim 500GB launch first and then 1TB model?

Also I remembered the PS4 wifi was garbage because of Dualshock 4 using same band. Glad they changed that.
 

Bryank75

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- Codename "Ellewood" is the (already revealed) black 1TB Xbox Series S.
- Codename "Brooklin" will be an all digital Xbox Series X with 2TB.
"Same great price $499" according to Microsoft.

This might be all Microsoft has for Xbox this gen. A $499 Xbox Series X with 2TB without a disc-drive. And a new controller.
Meanwhile Sony is working on a more powerful PS5 Pro. As it looks like right now, Sony will have a new PS5 model later this year for $399. It's all digital but you can upgrade it with a modular disc-drive. And it's possible that the more powerful PS5 Pro will launch in October 2024 for $499. The same price as the Xbox Series X mid-gen refresh.

This would be hilarious tbh.
The most powerful console in the world, the PS5 Pro, versus the same old Xbox Series X and the weak Xbox Series S potato.

And they would be phasing out the old Series X, so no disc versions.
 

Say1nMan

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Soooo same $500 price point but for a disc less all digital console that has no power increase? Yeah, Xbox is the gift that keeps on giving. :ROFLMAO:
 

anonpuffs

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What's 6nm mean
Tsmc process node, nm = nanometers, it's a (mostly inaccurate these days) measure of how small a given semiconductor manufacturing process can make their transistors. Ps5/xsx launched with their cpu/gpu on 7nm, ps5 revisions have gone down to 6nm. Each step down may give chip size decreases, power efficiency savings, or speed/throughput increases. For 7nm->6nm i think the ps5 saved about 20-30 watts of power while running at load, which allowed sony to reduce the size of the heatsink.
 
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Tsmc process node, nm = nanometers, it's a (mostly inaccurate these days) measure of how small a given semiconductor manufacturing process can make their transistors. Ps5/xsx launched with their cpu/gpu on 7nm, ps5 revisions have gone down to 6nm. Each step down may give chip size decreases, power efficiency savings, or speed/throughput increases. For 7nm->6nm i think the ps5 saved about 20-30 watts of power while running at load, which allowed sony to reduce the size of the heatsink.
I got my ps5 October or November last year so mines probably that model just not sure if it's a good thing or not 😂
 

anonpuffs

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It's not better though is it just smaller & probably costs less to manufacture
7nm->6nm is not much of an improvement but ->5nm is a big improvement. It allows chips to run faster and cooler. For example 16 core Zen3 AMD cpus were on 7nm and had a boost clock of 4.9ghz. But 16 core Zen4 cpus are on 5nm and clock up to 5.7ghz.
 
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7nm->6nm is not much of an improvement but ->5nm is a big improvement. It allows chips to run faster and cooler. For example 16 core Zen3 AMD cpus were on 7nm and had a boost clock of 4.9ghz. But 16 core Zen4 cpus are on 5nm and clock up to 5.7ghz.
Sounds really complicated I'd think the bigger the chip is the more power you could get from it not the other way around lol
 

anonpuffs

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Sounds really complicated I'd think the bigger the chip is the more power you could get from it not the other way around lol
The limits on chips are the area of the die (more stuff = more math you can do at a time) and heat (beyond ~110-120*C the silicon actually melts). The smaller the transistor the less heat it generates so shrinking them makes it so that you can run them faster. Also, the bigger the chip the more likely that a defect in the process will render the whole chip unusable. Lastly there's something called a reticle limit which is how big of a pattern the machine can make at a time, which limits the max size of a chip.

Bigger chip = much more expensive. It's part of the reason why a 4090 is $1600.

So for example (made-up numbers)
If on 7nm you can get 20 billion transistors on a 200mm^2 chip, on 6nm you might be able to get the same 20 billion transistors on a 160mm^2 chip. That means per silicon wafer you get 25% more chips, which means they might be cheaper to produce, you have to throw out less $ in bad/defective chips.
 
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nongkris

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Yeah the digital only xbox is getting a lot of bad push back online. If Xbox really does release this and officially kill off physical games on their platform then they're even more dead as a brand than they already are.
 

ToTTenTranz

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No, you call it that. What you call it is inconsequential to this discussion.

I believe the term "mid-gen" was first coined with the PS4 Pro and then the One X.
Head out to wikipedia and the term "mid-generation" refers to the more powerful 8th-gen consoles, but the same term can't be found for the 7th-gen or 6th-gen.

Microsoft calling these refresh models "mid-gen" is the real outlier here. There's nothing "mid-gen" about launching a console with the exact same processing and memory specs but upgraded wireless and I/O.

These slides even look promotional and make it seem a bit like Microsoft is pretending to have mid-gen consoles, when they actually don't have them.
 

Cool hand luke

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Yeah the digital only xbox is getting a lot of bad push back online. If Xbox really does release this and officially kill off physical games on their platform then they're even more dead as a brand than they already are.
Digital only will kill their retail presence so I guess that's that.
 

historia

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I believe the term "mid-gen" was first coined with the PS4 Pro and then the One X.
Head out to wikipedia and the term "mid-generation" refers to the more powerful 8th-gen consoles, but the same term can't be found for the 7th-gen or 6th-gen.

Microsoft calling these refresh models "mid-gen" is the real outlier here. There's nothing "mid-gen" about launching a console with the exact same processing and memory specs but upgraded wireless and I/O.

These slides even look promotional and make it seem a bit like Microsoft is pretending to have mid-gen consoles, when they actually don't have them.
52 CUs vs 54 CUs.

My guess for promotion.
 

ToTTenTranz

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52 CUs vs 54 CUs.

My guess for promotion.

The specs slide clearly say 12TF, so they didn't activate any more CUs nor did they increase the clocks.
I'm not sure they could, either. They disabled one WGP per shader engine and I don't know if the work schedulers would work with asymmetrical engines.