Remember when Naughty Dog used to make New Games

Dr Bass

The doctor is in
Founder
20 Jun 2022
2,037
3,445
There's a big difference: The PS5 generation is the most successful one for Sony, while the PS3 one was the least successful one.

Being specific to ND, their most successful game ever in sales and awards was TLOU2, released just before the PS5 release. They now have way more workers they ever had, and for the first time they now have been working on 3 new games at the same time (plus possible additional secondary projects like ports/remakes/remasters/movie or tv show adaptations).

TLOU2 was released aprox. 3 years and a half ago, and nowadays AAA games take 5-9 years to be developed. Assuming they took a few months after TLOU2 release to start their next SP game (ignoring TLOU Online), then it would be aprox. 2-7 years away from release, so I wouldn't expect it to be shown this or next year. Specially to avoid something like with TLOU Online, when they shown early a game that later got cancelled.

I'd bet this time won't announce their next game until pretty close to the game release, maximum a year before releasing it. Which would mean they'd announce it somewhere around 2025-2030. Their other SP game apparently started in H1 2023, meaning pretty likely they'd announce it somewhere around 2027-2032.
What game that’s well managed takes nine years to make?
 

ToTTenTranz

Veteran
Icon Extra
4 Aug 2023
1,531
1,600
Being specific to ND, their most successful game ever in sales and awards was TLOU2, released just before the PS5 release.

In awards, yes. In sales, not even a little bit.
2 years after release it had sold less than half of Spider-Man, God of War 2018 and Horizon Zero Dawn.



And considering the fact that >40% of those 10 million sales were pre-orders (i.e. leap of faith purchases taken from goodwill gained over the 1st game), there should be very little doubt that TLoU2 sold as much as Sony had hoped.
 

Yurinka

Veteran
VIP
21 Jun 2022
7,689
6,579
What game that’s well managed takes nine years to make?
Big ass AAA games requiring a ton of work/time to be made or having delays, specially with a pandemic in the middle, don't imply bad management.

It just means huge projects require huge development times.

In awards, yes. In sales, not even a little bit.

SIE's SVP & head of global marketing: "We’re delighted to report that The Last of Us Part II is now the fastest-selling first-party PS4 exclusive ever".

In 2020 TLOU2 broke sales records, in 2022 they did with GoWR, in 2023 with Spider-Man 2 and in 2024 with -minimum- Helldivers 2.


And considering the fact that >40% of those 10 million sales were pre-orders (i.e. leap of faith purchases taken from goodwill gained over the 1st game), there should be very little doubt that TLoU2 sold as much as Sony had hoped.
Any source for this >40%? Why not to say 40000% instead?
 
Last edited:

voke

Veteran
10 Jan 2023
2,532
3,278
They make top end games. It takes more than a couple years to achieve that. They'll be ready to melt our eyes 2026-2027 for sure.

Those of you blaming Sony management, you have no real understanding on how game development works.
 
  • they're_right_you_know
Reactions: Yurinka
OP
OP
Box

Box

May contain Snake
6 Apr 2023
3,500
3,759
They make top end games. It takes more than a couple years to achieve that. They'll be ready to melt our eyes 2026-2027 for sure.

Those of you blaming Sony management, you have no real understanding on how game development works.

So why has Insomniac been able to release 3 AAA games in the same timeframe?
 

Yurinka

Veteran
VIP
21 Jun 2022
7,689
6,579
So why has Insomniac been able to release 3 AAA games in the same timeframe?
Because since a ton of years before that timeframe, unlike the other studios, Insomniac had way more people and they were always working in 3/4 games at the same time, while most of the other teams only did work on a single game at the same time.

Only with Jimbo and Hermen many of the other teams also got 2, 3 or even 4 teams at the same time working on multiple games at the same time. And these new times will need the average time to develop AAA games, which aren't developed in under a year because we are not in the PS1 generation, or in 2 or 3 like in the PS3 generation, games are way bigger and way more complex than back then.

Insomniac doesn't have any magic formula, they aren't superhuman. They only had more people/teams to work in more games at the same time than the other ones.
 

Vertigo

Did you show the Darkness what Light can do?
26 Jun 2022
5,460
4,953
Insomniac was able to iterate efficiently and reuse and update assets and tech. Their approach to the marvel universe is not so much different than GAAS. It’s a consistent content pipeline that they clearly have a handle on.

Naughty Dog definitely “lost time” by cancelling TLOU Online even if I agree with the their logic behind their decision.

I doubt anyone at Sony or Naughty Dog is happy about this but shit happens. The remasters and upgrades are probably to also make up for lost revenues with falling behind schedule. How they move forward, if the right course correction… could be worth it. To me that’s a trust issue and I mostly trust Sony to handle stuff accordingly.
 
OP
OP
Box

Box

May contain Snake
6 Apr 2023
3,500
3,759
Insomniac was able to iterate efficiently and reuse and update assets and tech. Their approach to the marvel universe is not so much different than GAAS. It’s a consistent content pipeline that they clearly have a handle on.

Efficiency is what matters, the fans want new great games to play and that's exactly what insomniac has been delivering.

Sony needs to expand them, since they seem to be the only first party actually releasing games on ps5 this gen.

If we don't see any New Games from Naughty Dog in the next showcase, i would seriously advocate for Sony Shutting them down.
 

mibu no ookami

Veteran
21 Feb 2024
2,046
1,797
Efficiency is what matters, the fans want new great games to play and that's exactly what insomniac has been delivering.

Sony needs to expand them, since they seem to be the only first party actually releasing games on ps5 this gen.

If we don't see any New Games from Naughty Dog in the next showcase, i would seriously advocate for Sony Shutting them down.

LOL, you're a complete clown/troll.

The next two Naughty Dog games will probably be more profitable than everything Insomniac has done this generation.

It's funny that you talk about efficiency, but releasing a remake and ports are the definition of efficiency.
 

mibu no ookami

Veteran
21 Feb 2024
2,046
1,797
There were 4 years in between Uncharted 4 and The Last of Us Part 2. Knowing that the studio dealt with a pandemic that would have slowed them down, knowing that games take longer to develop now than they did in the previous generation, knowing that they are working on multiple projects, you still have jokers who think that they should have released 2 games by now just because Insomniac reused their engine and map 3 times in 5 years.

There is a reason why Insomniac games barely hit 90 whereas that's largely the floor for Naughty Dog games.

Comparing the two studios is an absolute joke.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Yobo

Wing84

Active member
7 Feb 2024
176
151
Efficiency is what matters, the fans want new great games to play and that's exactly what insomniac has been delivering.

Sony needs to expand them, since they seem to be the only first party actually releasing games on ps5 this gen.

If we don't see any New Games from Naughty Dog in the next showcase, i would seriously advocate for Sony Shutting them down.
If Sony expanded a team, they'll have to charge more for their games, a thing a lot of gamers seem to ignore.

I think the only option is to either break up games into a FF7: Remake situation (but spanning one generation) to capitalize on preexisting assets for a high ROI or scale down the graphical fidelity of games and maybe offer a visual upgrade option for the spec chasers.
 
OP
OP
Box

Box

May contain Snake
6 Apr 2023
3,500
3,759
There is a reason why Insomniac games barely hit 90 whereas that's largely the floor for Naughty Dog games.

You and Neil Druckmann can both jerk off to the Metacritic score together while the rest of us enjoy these insomniac games.


The next two Naughty Dog games will probably be more profitable than everything Insomniac has done this generation.

I'm sure my grandchildren will really enjoy those games.


If Sony expanded a team, they'll have to charge more for their games, a thing a lot of gamers seem to ignore.

Why would they need to charge more for games?
 
  • they're_right_you_know
Reactions: Gediminas

Nhomnhom

Banned
25 Mar 2023
8,414
11,558
Nobody would care if Naughty Dog did a million remasters if they showed what they were working on
They can't show it without peoples lives being put at risk. They are working on a combat simulator game that includes top secret weapons that the general public can't be made aware of yet.
 
  • haha
  • fire
Reactions: Box and Gediminas

Wing84

Active member
7 Feb 2024
176
151
Why would they need to charge more for games?
More expenses on game release = less profit on game release

More expenses during development = Cash reserves shrinking faster

I don't understand how any adult can't see this, especially gamers after seeing Sony talking about their profits are shrinking.
 
OP
OP
Box

Box

May contain Snake
6 Apr 2023
3,500
3,759
More expenses on game release = less profit on game release

More expenses during development = Cash reserves shrinking faster

I don't understand how any adult can't see this, especially gamers after seeing Sony talking about their profits are shrinking.

Each Ubisoft game has thousands of people working on it.

Not sure why you seem to think your theory is fact? More people working on it also means less development time which reduces overall cost.
 

Wing84

Active member
7 Feb 2024
176
151
Each Ubisoft game has thousands of people working on it.

Not sure why you seem to think your theory is fact? More people working on it also means less development time which reduces overall cost.
Oh boy. Software development does not work like that. The only way more people can be a net positive (financially) is if they become their own internal team, producing their own games.
 

Yobo

Veteran
29 Jun 2022
1,973
2,831
They can't show it without peoples lives being put at risk. They are working on a combat simulator game that includes top secret weapons that the general public can't be made aware of yet.
Theyve been pretty honest about why they won't show games too early anymore