What does Sony need to realistically release next year to stay ahead of the competition?

[peter42O]

Right now Sony is still doing well because they are riding on the success of the PS4, while Microsoft's new studios and publishers are still developing their new AAA games.
As soon as Microsoft's 1st party studios are ready (2023), it will be the beginning of the end for PlayStation as a platform. Xbox will be everywhere with the help of Xcloud. Consoles, TVs, Mobile, Tablets, PC... maybe even on your toaster. You only need a controller. Sony is still struggling with their cloud strategy and their mediocre services.

While I agree with you in regards to Microsoft wanting Xbox to be everywhere, this will take time and they do have a ways to go yet. PlayStation as a platform will be just as good next generation as they are this generation and in no way, shape or form will PlayStation end. While I do believe that Game Pass is better than PlayStation Plus, they still have over 45m paid monthly subscribers and while the Premium tier leaves a little to be desired, the base PlayStation Plus subscription shits all over Xbox Live Gold and Extra tier is pretty good in of itself. As for Sony's cloud strategy, it's years away from being properly and fully implemented.

Microsoft is buying publishers! Publishers including famous IPs. Not some small random no-name studios like Haven or Savage Game Studio.
Microsoft will own some of the biggest gaming franchises ever. No matter if it's Minecraft, Call of Duty, Warcraft, Starcraft, Diablo, Overwatch, Elder Scrolls or Fallout. They own some of the biggest studios and publishers that ever existed. Microsoft pretty much dominates the whole WRPG and FPS genre. Minecraft is still the king for the kids.
Meanwhile you have Sony with some mediocre 1st party studios like PixelOpus, London Studio, Media Molecule (Dreams is a 10-year-failure), Valkyrie Entertainment, Haven, Asobi Team, San Diego Studio, Nixxes, or Firesprite.

I agree with the Microsoft part. But whether or not all the acquisitions pays off with great games is a wait and see.

As for the Sony first party studios you mention, im very interested in what PixelOpus and Team Asobi do. No interest in the rest but I wouldn't say any of them are mediocre. They're at least borderline good at the very least with a few of them remaining to be seen based on what their next project is.

If you're honest you will admit that PlayStation Studios only has 4 relevant/succeesful AAAstudios. Naughty Dog (Uncharted, TLOU), Santa Monica Studio (GOW), Guerrilla Games (Horizon) and Sucker Punch (Ghost of Tsushima).
The rest of them are some unsuccessful AA studios like Housemarque or Savage Game Studio disguising as AAA studios. Or some random port/remake studios like Bluepoint, Valkyrie and Nixxes no one gives a shit about. And Polyphony is a joke compared to Turn 10 and Playground Games.
Of course there is Insomniac Games who's struggling to create new successful AAA IPs, so they have to work on foreign licenses (Marvel Spider-Man & Wolverine) to be succeesful.

Savage Game Studios is a mobile studio and is Sony's equivalent of Microsoft's Alpha Dog Games. No biggie. Bluepoint did an excellent job with remaking Demon's Souls. Housemarque is a favorite of mine. I loved Outland, Dead Nation, Alienation and Nex Machina. Only Matterfall was disappointing. As for Returnal, that game would be an easy 8.5/10 - 9.0/10 for me personally if it wasn't a rogue like game because from visuals to audio to combat/gameplay was all great. Polyphony Digital is great but I do see Playground Games as better and Turn 10 should be better with the next Forza Motorsport.

However, I love Insomniac Games and easily prefer Spider Man over for example Sunset Overdrive which I played for maybe 30 minutes if that. I would easily take what Insomniac is doing now compared to getting new IP's that like Sunset Overdrive, I may not even like or want to begin with.

Insomniac if anything is more successful now because of those licensed games than ever before and it doesn't matter how a studio gets there, as long as they get there. So in my opinion, it's 5 studios - the 4 you listed and Insomniac which is my #1 Sony studio.

 

[Satoru]

Don't patronize someone because of their differing opinion. I thought we went over this.

If you think Sleepy Brown is presenting a differing opinion and not just trolling... I honestly feel sad.

 

[Yurinka]

As soon as Microsoft's 1st party studios are ready (2023), it will be the beginning of the end for PlayStation as a platform.

Won't happen. Microsoft doesn't dominate a single top selling genre, while most of them are mostly played on PS via multiplatform or exclusive games. There is a a huge difference between active userbase and demand between PS and Xbox and there aren't signs that this could change.

Xbox will be everywhere with the help of Xcloud. Consoles, TVs, Mobile, Tablets, PC... maybe even on your toaster. You only need a controller. Sony is still struggling with their cloud strategy and their mediocre services.

There is absolutely no number of active xcloud users. Sony's game sub has like twice the subs of the MS one. MS stopped sharing the number of GP subs in the later months which doesn't seem to indicate that GP grew a lot, and that's during ABK acquisition and with the Zenimax games started to be included.

Microsoft is buying publishers! Publishers including famous IPs.

Sony is buying too.

Not some small random no-name studios like Haven or Savage Game Studio.

Haven has some of the key talent behind Assassin's Creed or Watchdogs, which broke sales records for a new IP, and also other very successful games like top GaaS eSports game Rainbow Six Siege. And well, many of other top AAA.

Savage has key talent from several of the biggest mobile companies in the world.

Microsoft will own some of the biggest gaming franchises ever. No matter if it's Minecraft, Call of Duty, Warcraft, Starcraft, Diablo, Overwatch, Elder Scrolls or Fallout.

Most of the key talent that made these brands great isn't there anymore. In fact part of them are now working for Sony in places like Bungie, Deviation or Firewalk. This is part of the reason of why some of these franchises were really big in the past but aren't that big anymore.

They own some of the biggest studios and publishers that ever existed. Microsoft pretty much dominates the whole WRPG and FPS genre. Minecraft is still the king for the kids.

ABK is the biggest 3rd party publisher yes, and Minecraft was very successful one hit wonder whose success they weren't able to repeat with more games. Other than that they aren't that big. The king for the kids is now Fortnite, and its top platform is PlayStation.

WRPG is not a genre, and MS doesn't dominate it because doesn't own Rockstar, Sony, Ubisoft or CDP to name a few. The recent WRPGs of these companies sold better than the Bethesda games released in the last decade or so. And guess where do they sell the most: PlayStation.

PlayStation is also the best selling platform for shooters (including games like Fornite or even GTA) and particularly FPS are mostly bought and played in PS: Destiny, Apex Legends, Rainbow Six, Call of Duty etc. CoD, game that multiple times MS said that they'll keep relesing it on PS because it wouldn't be profitable to make it exclusive.

Meanwhile you have Sony with some mediocre 1st party studios like PixelOpus, London Studio, Media Molecule (Dreams is a 10-year-failure), Valkyrie Entertainment, Haven, Asobi Team, San Diego Studio, Nixxes, or Firesprite.

Your beloved Kinect wouldn't have existed without the previous hit Eye Toy, made by London Studio. Your beloved Minecraft woouldn't exist withour the previous hit Little Big Planet, made by Media Molecule. Btw, all Media Molecule games have been profitable, something MS can't say.

I already talked above about Haven. Team Asobi is the merge of the different internal development teams that Japan Studio had. San Diego Studio makes the most successful baseball series in gaming. Nixxes is a top tier PC porting studio. Firesprite is the basically the mixture of Liverpool Studio, Evolution and Bizarre Creations, made good VR games and now are working on the current most promising VR game.

If you're honest you will admit that PlayStation Studios only has 4 relevant/succeesful AAAstudios. Naughty Dog (Uncharted, TLOU), Santa Monica Studio (GOW), Guerrilla Games (Horizon) and Sucker Punch (Ghost of Tsushima).
The rest of them are some unsuccessful AA studios like Housemarque or Savage Game Studio disguising as AAA studios.

The recent games from studios like Bend or Polyphony sold better than recent games from most MS studios.

Or some random port/remake studios like Bluepoint, Valkyrie and Nixxes no one gives a shit about. And Polyphony is a joke compared to Turn 10 and Playground Games.
Of course there is Insomniac Games who's struggling to create new successful AAA IPs, so they have to work on foreign licenses (Marvel Spider-Man & Wolverine) to be succeesful.

Bluepoint has a better metacritic than most MS studios and unlike most of MS studios they released a new gen only game. Polyphony sells more games than Polyphony and Turn 10. When was the last time Turn 10 and PlayGround games had a great position in an important sales ranking? Gran Turismo 7 debuted in NPD with its best debut month ever in the series making a top 2, only having Elden Ring above it.

Insomniac is the most successful studio making superhero games in gaming history and created more successful new IPs than most MS studios. They also released a next gen only games unlike most MS studios.

 

[Perrott]

I feel the question is more of a "what can Sony release" than "what they'd need to release", since I don't think any of their unannounced heavy-hitters (think Ragnarok-level games) from their most prestigious studios and partners are even remotely ready to be released within the next 12 months.

Spider-Man 2 is still scheduled for 2023 and I expect that to be their flagship PS5 game, and it better score a 90+ on Metacritic in order to live up to both the hype and any expectation Sony might have of it being a GOTY contender for next year's awards season.

Other than Spider-Man 2, I don't expect any other story-driven singleplayer behemoth from PlayStation in 2023, but a handful of live-service games instead - Helldivers 2, Factions, Twisted Metal - in addition to some remasters of PS4 games, including the recently leaked Horizon: Zero Dawn and very possibly The Last Of Us: Part II. There might some smaller hybrid game effort from PS Studios that turn out to be playable on both PS5 and PSVR2 as well.

And talking about VR, there's already Horizon: Call of the Mountain confirmed as a launch game for the headset, with Firewall Ultra on its way too. Other than that? I feel a VR release for Gran Turismo 7 is a given, as well as a enhanced editions of Déraciné and Marvel's Iron Man VR (which was recently announced for Meta's VR devices), among others. Unfortunately, Sony's first-party doesn't seem to give the impression of being very commited to PSVR2, so I wouldn't expect much else in its first year.

Leaving first-party aside, they'll also have major titles with varying degrees of exclusivity from third-party partners - such as Silent Hill 2 Remake, Final Fantasy XVI, Forspoken, Granblue Fantasy: Relink or Stellar Blade.

With all that in mind, I get the feeling PlayStation-centric gamers are in for a quite packed 2023.

 

[Yurinka]

Factions,

Regarding TLOU Online, I think it won't be ready for 2023. But according to Druckmann it's going to be their biggest project ever and even if MP will have a narrative focus, they apparently found a way to integrate narrative into multiplayer. So I'm sure it's going to be a ND level top tier hit in metacritic and sales when released (I think it will release in 2024).

 

[Bryank75]

I feel the question is more of a "what can Sony release" than "what they'd need to release", since I don't think any of their unannounced heavy-hitters (think Ragnarok-level games) from their most prestigious studios and partners are even remotely ready to be released within the next 12 months.

Spider-Man 2 is still scheduled for 2023 and I expect that to be their flagship PS5 game, and it better score a 90+ on Metacritic in order to live up to both the hype and any expectation Sony might have of it being a GOTY contender for next year's awards season.

Other than Spider-Man 2, I don't expect any other story-driven singleplayer behemoth from PlayStation in 2023, but a handful of live-service games instead - Helldivers 2, Factions, Twisted Metal - in addition to some remasters of PS4 games, including the recently leaked Horizon: Zero Dawn and very possibly The Last Of Us: Part II. There might some smaller hybrid game effort from PS Studios that turn out to be playable on both PS5 and PSVR2 as well.

And talking about VR, there's already Horizon: Call of the Mountain confirmed as a launch game for the headset, with Firewall Ultra on its way too. Other than that? I feel a VR release for Gran Turismo 7 is a given, as well as a enhanced editions of Déraciné and Marvel's Iron Man VR (which was recently announced for Meta's VR devices), among others. Unfortunately, Sony's first-party doesn't seem to give the impression of being very commited to PSVR2, so I wouldn't expect much else in its first year.

Leaving first-party aside, they'll also have major titles with varying degrees of exclusivity from third-party partners - such as Silent Hill 2 Remake, Final Fantasy XVI, Forspoken, Granblue Fantasy: Relink or Stellar Blade.

With all that in mind, I get the feeling PlayStation-centric gamers are in for a quite packed 2023.

Great to see you buddy!

I agree, from a big-picture perspective 2023 should be an amazing year and Bungie are part of Sony too so I guess if one was inclined they could include Lightfall as a PlayStation release and I am really excited for that as well as the Final Fantasy games and of course Spider-man and many others.

So it will definitely be a top year for me, personally.

 

[peter42O]

I feel the question is more of a "what can Sony release" than "what they'd need to release", since I don't think any of their unannounced heavy-hitters (think Ragnarok-level games) from their most prestigious studios and partners are even remotely ready to be released within the next 12 months.

Spider-Man 2 is still scheduled for 2023 and I expect that to be their flagship PS5 game, and it better score a 90+ on Metacritic in order to live up to both the hype and any expectation Sony might have of it being a GOTY contender for next year's awards season.

Other than Spider-Man 2, I don't expect any other story-driven singleplayer behemoth from PlayStation in 2023, but a handful of live-service games instead - Helldivers 2, Factions, Twisted Metal - in addition to some remasters of PS4 games, including the recently leaked Horizon: Zero Dawn and very possibly The Last Of Us: Part II. There might some smaller hybrid game effort from PS Studios that turn out to be playable on both PS5 and PSVR2 as well.

And talking about VR, there's already Horizon: Call of the Mountain confirmed as a launch game for the headset, with Firewall Ultra on its way too. Other than that? I feel a VR release for Gran Turismo 7 is a given, as well as a enhanced editions of Déraciné and Marvel's Iron Man VR (which was recently announced for Meta's VR devices), among others. Unfortunately, Sony's first-party doesn't seem to give the impression of being very commited to PSVR2, so I wouldn't expect much else in its first year.

Leaving first-party aside, they'll also have major titles with varying degrees of exclusivity from third-party partners - such as Silent Hill 2 Remake, Final Fantasy XVI, Forspoken, Granblue Fantasy: Relink or Stellar Blade.

With all that in mind, I get the feeling PlayStation-centric gamers are in for a quite packed 2023.

I agree with this. And like Lost Soul Aside, where the hell is Granblue Fantasy Relink?? Both of these games are taking forever.

Regarding TLOU Online, I think it won't be ready for 2023. But according to Druckmann it's going to be their biggest project ever and even if MP will have a narrative focus, they apparently found a way to integrate narrative into multiplayer. So I'm sure it's going to be a ND level top tier hit in metacritic and sales when released (I think it will release in 2024).

I'm going with 2023 and I believe that it will be free to play on PC/PS4/PS5.

 

[Vertigo]

Regarding TLOU Online, I think it won't be ready for 2023. But according to Druckmann it's going to be their biggest project ever and even if MP will have a narrative focus, they apparently found a way to integrate narrative into multiplayer. So I'm sure it's going to be a ND level top tier hit in metacritic and sales when released (I think it will release in 2024).

I was thinking it would be their big release for next year alongside spider-man 2. One big online game, one big single player game sounds like a solid holiday push.

I’m not expecting f2p if it’s a narrative heavy pve game. Full retail price. I mean… you just paid 70$ for a TLOU remake. I think that also puts things in perspective here.

I totally forgot about Helldivers btw. We only had that leaked footage and no official word on anything right? It may not have room to breathe… good luck.

 

[Sleepy Brown]

Sony is buying too.

They are buying random no-name studios like Haven or Savage Game Studios.
Microsoft is buying publishers with some of the biggest and most famous IPs in the world. Call of Duty, Overwatch, Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Doom, Wolfenstein, Warcraft, Starcraft, Diablo, Crash Bandicoot, Wolfenstein, etc.

Sony's biggest acquisition ever was Bungie and the Destiny IP. And the only reason for this is because they want to finally have some successful GaaS games. So they bought (and overpaid) a successful GaaS studio with some longtime GaaS-experience.

Microsoft will continue to buy successful studios, publishers and IPs while Sony is going to buy "No-Name Interactive" from Transylvania.
They have no money for big acquisitions (of publishers, famous IPs, etc.).
That's why you see them "investing" in studios. Like when they purchased a 14% minority stake in From Software. It's 14% because they don't have the money to buy these big studios with famous IPs. And they surely have no mony to buy a publisher. That's the reason why you see Jim Ryan crying to the CMA every week about the Activision-Blizzard deal.

 

[Yurinka]

I'm going with 2023 and I believe that it will be free to play on PC/PS4/PS5.

I think that if as Druckmann said it's bigger than a ND game and even if being MP still is story focused like their SP games, it has potential to sell around 20M copies on PS being full priced plus on top of that make a lot of extra money with IAP/DLC/season passes (whatever they do on their GaaS approach). And they can keep the PC version for around 2 years after launch, or a year and something maybe.

TLOU is a very premium IP, I think that for these top IPs before going F2P they'll try paid GaaS games as they did with in MLB or GT7 and will go F2P once they mastered the addon monetization or the games don't sell anymore. I think we'll see going F2P at launch other lower tier, AAish IPs as could be Twisted Metal.

 

[peter42O]

I think that if as Druckmann said it's bigger than a ND game and even if being MP still is story focused like their SP games, it has potential to sell around 20M copies on PS being full priced plus on top of that make a lot of extra money with IAP/DLC/season passes (whatever they do on their GaaS approach). And they can keep the PC version for around 2 years after launch, or a year and something maybe.

TLOU is a very premium IP, I think that for these top IPs before going F2P they'll try paid GaaS games as they did with in MLB or GT7 and will go F2P once they mastered the addon monetization or the games don't sell anymore. I think we'll see going F2P at launch other lower tier, AAish IPs as could be Twisted Metal.

Wait........am I understanding you correctly when you say "keep the PC for around 2 years after launch" as in releasing later on PC and only PS5 day one? If so, Sony has already confirmed their live service games coming to PC day one because for these games, it's all about player counts. If Sony charges $70 for Factions, im not expecting a big player base for this game because the reason why TLOU is a premium IP, it's because of the story and characters. TLOU MP was real good but that's not what made TLOU what it is today. If im misunderstanding you, please correct me.

MLB and GT 7 are different because if the player wants to, they can play them solo and go through the season for MLB and the campaign for GT 7. With Factions, it's a pure online multi-player focused game and for these games to succeed, they need to be free to play. There's too much competition out there from games that are way more established in this area for Factions to be a $70 launch title.

But we'll see what they do.

 

[Yurinka]

They are buying random no-name studios like Haven or Savage Game Studios.
Microsoft is buying publishers with some of the biggest and most famous IPs in the world. Call of Duty, Overwatch, Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Doom, Wolfenstein, Warcraft, Starcraft, Diablo, Crash Bandicoot, Wolfenstein, etc.

Sony bought the most successful talent who made top tier successful new IP and/or top tier games, as Bungie, Haven or Savage. Productive talent who releases stuff.

MS instead bought mostly empty shells, names that some of them were once great but are no longer at the level these companies had because most of their key talent isn't there anymore. Not very productive folks who take forever to release a game.

Sony's biggest acquisition ever was Bungie and the Destiny IP. And the only reason for this is because they want to finally have some successful GaaS games. So they bought (and overpaid) a successful GaaS studio with some longtime GaaS-experience.
Microsoft will continue to buy successful studios, publishers and IPs while Sony is going to buy "No-Name Interactive" from Transylvania.
They have no money for big acquisitions (of publishers, famous IPs, etc.).
That's why you see them "investing" in studios. Like when they purchased a 14% minority stake in From Software. It's 14% because they don't have the money to buy these big studios with famous IPs. And they surely have no mony to buy a publisher. That's the reason why you see Jim Ryan crying to the CMA every week about the Activision-Blizzard deal.

Yes, Destiny is a great example of a top tier GaaS. Unlike the utter failure that is the still unfinished Halo Infinite, that like ESO and Fallout 76 is GaaS shadow of former glory of these brands once were.

Sony doesn't need to make huge acquisitions because unlike MS they are already super successful in gaming, they recently shown the most successful Q2 ever posted by a console maker and the biggest revenue ever made by a game sub of any console maker.

MS makes huge acquisitions overpaying a 45% premium for a huge publisher like ABK that has most IPs on a declining state that lost most of its key talent and with several controversies of messed management because they are desperate, don't know another way of competing against Sony and Nintendo. They have no idea of making new huge hits anymore and even less hit new IPs, so they have to buy them. They are even almost giving them away with their subscription to see if in this way someone plays them because nobody buys them compared to Sony and MS. And even doing that and almost giving away their subscription can't compete with Sony in subs or revenue.

Sony makes relatively small acquisitions to make improvements and grow here and there, little tweaks in different areas. What they paid for the 100% of Bungie shares is around of 10% of Sony's yearly gaming revenue. Or less than their gaming division had in profits last year. Barely nothing compared to what MS for paid for ABK, specially comparing it to MS's yearly gaming yearly revenue and well, it's a joke to expect profits from MS gaming, a failure that needs dozens of billions from other divisions to try (and fail) to become competitive.

Sony doesn't need to buy big brands, they already have them and know how to make new ones. And is super successful and profitable without needing money from other divisions. They have money to buy publisher but decided to spend less money investing on Epic, Devolver, FromSoft and others, allowing them to continue publishing elsewhere and doing whatever they want (and in exchange of the investment Sony gets part of their profits).

 

[Yurinka]

Wait........am I understanding you correctly when you say "keep the PC for around 2 years after launch" as in releasing later on PC and only PS5 day one?

Yes, Hermen Hulst said that they were happy with releasing (some, they won't port all their games to PC) their games a couple of years later. In the case of the story focused narrive ones, he said they'd be released at least a year later. Said that don't plan to release them day one on PC.

If so, Sony has already confirmed their live service games coming to PC day one because for these games, it's all about player counts.

He didn't say that all GaaS will be day one on PC. He said that 'eventually' some 'might' be released day one on PC depending the case.

If Sony charges $70 for Factions, im not expecting a big player base for this game because the reason why TLOU is a premium IP, it's because of the story and characters. TLOU MP was real good but that's not what made TLOU what it is today. If im misunderstanding you, please correct me.

This game won't be only like the Factions mode of TLOU1, a small MP game mode, but for TLOU2. This game is going to be bigger than any other previous ND game and even if MP it will keep their story focused narrative focus, so a great story with great characters etc. So like other AAA GaaS games from Sony like Destiny 2, Little Big Planet or Gran Turismo 7 I think it will be paid at least at launch because it's a very expensive game. Sony knows how to make these games profitable by selling them, but still has no expertise with F2P to make profitable games that costed hundreds of millions.

MLB and GT 7 are different because if the player wants to, they can play them solo and go through the season for MLB and the campaign for GT 7. With Factions, it's a pure online multi-player focused game and for these games to succeed, they need to be free to play. There's too much competition out there from games that are way more established in this area for Factions to be a $70 launch title.

But we'll see what they do.

We know don't know how the game is exactly going to be, in fact we don't know if it's going to have a Factions game mode.

We only know it will have multiplayer and -unlike Factions in TLOU1- a story comparable to the other ND games. We don't know what kind of MP will have. Maybe it's like Destiny, where there is a story that you can play alone even if there are other players around optionally joining you for story missions or raids and then having separate pvp modes. Destiny 1 did this as paid game and was super successful.

Regarging being F2P or not, most successful AAA games are paid ones. Only some F2P AAA games have been successful. F2P worked better for AAish games.

 

[peter42O]

Yes, Hermen Hulst said that they were happy with releasing (some, they won't port all their games to PC) their games a couple of years later. In the case of the story focused narrive ones, he said they'd be released at least a year later. Said that don't plan to release them day one on PC.

He didn't say that all GaaS will be day one on PC. He said that 'eventually' some 'might' be released day one on PC depending the case.

Obviously, we disagree here. I'm expecting their co-op/multi-player only games (Factions, Helldivers 2, etc.) to be on PC day one. While I think Helldivers 2 will be a paid title, I do think that Factions or whatever they end up calling it will be a free to play game. The rest will be day one on PC before this generations ends, easily. In two years, they already went from 4 years to 1 year. Only reason why it's even taking this long is because they only pivoted to doing this a few years ago.

This game won't be only like the Factions mode of TLOU1, a small MP game mode, but for TLOU2. This game is going to be bigger than any other previous ND game and even if MP it will keep their story focused narrative focus, so a great story with great characters etc. So like other AAA GaaS games from Sony like Destiny 2, Little Big Planet or Gran Turismo 7 I think it will be paid at least at launch because it's a very expensive game. Sony knows how to make these games profitable by selling them, but still has no expertise with F2P to make profitable games that costed hundreds of millions.

I don't see there being a story focus with Factions and I don't think it will be connected to TLOUP2. I think it will be a standalone game. You might get some story stuff but I don't see it being even half of what TLOU series has been story and character wise. Main reason being is that in multi-player games, those who are playing aren't playing for the story nor do they care about it. They're playing it for the gameplay/combat, loop, possibly loot and whatever other gameplay elements are in the game. Didn't Destiny 2 go free to play a few years ago?

We know don't know how the game is exactly going to be, in fact we don't know if it's going to have a Factions game mode.

We only know it will have multiplayer and -unlike Factions in TLOU1- a story comparable to the other ND games. We don't know what kind of MP will have. Maybe it's like Destiny, where there is a story that you can play alone even if there are other players around optionally joining you for story missions or raids and then having separate pvp modes. Destiny 1 did this as paid game and was super successful.

Regarging being F2P or not, most successful AAA games are paid ones. Only some F2P AAA games have been successful. F2P worked better for AAish games.

So there really is a story? Huh. In a multi-player focused game, I don't see the point of having a story because that's not why people play these games. Guess we'll see what they do. As for the free to play aspect, I think Sony does this because compared to Destiny 2, Apex Legends, Fortnite, Genshin Impact and many others, doesn't matter if it's AAA or AA, all these other games are simply far more established in the live service aspects than Sony is and to try to get into this field with a $70 multi-player only title that will probably have micro-transactions and who knows what else, I don't see them having a big player base compared to if it's free to play. And for these games, player count is far more important than your traditional game like TLOUP2 for example and in this regard, free to play and being cross-play with PC and possibly PS4 would be huge because they'll get more players into the game day one and as long as the post launch content is there, they should be able to retain the vast majority of that player base while also bringing in new players.

But again, we'll see what they do. It will definitely be interesting to see how it all goes.

 

[Yurinka]

Obviously, we disagree here. I'm expecting their co-op/multi-player only games (Factions, Helldivers 2, etc.) to be on PC day one. While I think Helldivers 2 will be a paid title, I do think that Factions or whatever they end up calling it will be a free to play game. The rest will be day one on PC before this generations ends, easily. In two years, they already went from 4 years to 1 year. Only reason why it's even taking this long is because they only pivoted to doing this a few years ago.

He didn't say that they will release their games a year after in PS. They continued and will continue releasing them several years later. But some may release around a year or so later, as was the case of the Uncharted remasters, but these games were originally released on PS several years before.

I don't see there being a story focus with Factions

It's what Druckamann said.

I think it will be a standalone game.

It will be a full standalone game, it isn't a DLC.

You might get some story stuff but I don't see it being even half of what TLOU series has been story and character wise.
Main reason being is that in multi-player games, those who are playing aren't playing for the story nor do they care about it. They're playing it for the gameplay/combat, loop, possibly loot and whatever other gameplay elements are in the game. Didn't Destiny 2 go free to play a few years ago?

Druckmann said it will be bigger than any game the made before and that will feature a story as usual in their games.
Destiny 2 went f2p, several years after being a paid game.

So there really is a story? Huh. In a multi-player focused game, I don't see the point of having a story because that's not why people play these games.

It did work pretty well for the Destiny games.

Guess we'll see what they do. As for the free to play aspect, I think Sony does this because compared to Destiny 2, Apex Legends, Fortnite, Genshin Impact and many others, doesn't matter if it's AAA or AA, all these other games are simply far more established in the live service aspects than Sony is and to try to get into this field with a $70 multi-player only title that will probably have micro-transactions and who knows what else.

I don't see them having a big player base compared to if it's free to play. And for these games, player count is far more important than your traditional game like TLOUP2 for example and in this regard, free to play and being cross-play with PC and possibly PS4 would be huge because they'll get more players into the game day one and as long as the post launch content is there, they should be able to retain the vast majority of that player base while also bringing in new players.

But again, we'll see what they do. It will definitely be interesting to see how it all goes.

There are a ton of popular $70 MP games, most of them aren't F2P. Like CoD, FIFA, GTA, Destiny, Rainbow 6 Siege, Battlefield and many more.

 

[peter42O]

He didn't say that they will release their games a year after in PS. They continued and will continue releasing them several years later. But some may release around a year or so later, as was the case of the Uncharted remasters, but these games were originally released on PS several years before.

It's what Druckamann said.

It will be a full standalone game, it isn't a DLC.

Druckmann said it will be bigger than any game the made before and that will feature a story as usual in their games.
Destiny 2 went f2p, several years after being a paid game.

It did work pretty well for the Destiny games.

There are a ton of popular $70 MP games, most of them aren't F2P. Like CoD, FIFA, GTA, Destiny, Rainbow 6 Siege, Battlefield and many more.

When I said standalone, I meant that you won't need the base game of TLOUP2 in order to play it. I know it's not a DLC. Okay, so we'll just have to see what kind of story is in the game. That makes me wonder if the game can be played solo. True, it has worked good for Destiny 2.

However, with the games you mentioned, there is one difference, all those games/franchises have been established with live services for a long time. For a few of them, over a decade. With Factions or whatever it ends up being called, not everyone is going to have the same confidence in this direction compared to their normal single player only story driven games.

 

[Sleepy Brown]

Sony bought the most successful talent who made top tier successful new IP and/or top tier games, as Bungie, Haven or Savage. Productive talent who releases stuff.

MS instead bought mostly empty shells, names that some of them were once great but are no longer at the level these companies had because most of their key talent isn't there anymore. Not very productive folks who take forever to release a game.

MS literally bought two publishers with a ton of teams, studios and famous IPs. Literally blockbuster IPs with a ton of talent.
This is complete nonsense.

 

[Perrott]

Sony's biggest acquisition ever was Bungie and the Destiny IP. And the only reason for this is because they want to finally have some successful GaaS games. So they bought (and overpaid) a successful GaaS studio with some longtime GaaS-experience.

While a major reason why they bought Bungie was because of their GaaS expertise, I also get the feeling they did so in order to help Bungie position themselves as a Blizzard/Riot level entertainment company, with several hit franchises and live-services going on at once rather than only Destiny.

Just by taking a peek at Bungie's job listings, it quickly becomes evident that they have a lot of stuff cooking at the moment. I personally don't care too much about their stuff since I'm no Destiny fan, but I remember people more informed than me on the matter pointing out that there are at least over half a dozen projects in various stages of production. That's a golden age Blizzard level of output right there, if they manage to pull it off.

So with that in mind, paying $3.6B for your own (and arguably better) Blizzard seems like a steal, especially when your competitor had to shell out tens of billions for them to get the actual Blizzard.

I feel the Bungie acquisition was as much of a great forward-thinking move as when Tencent made the call to buy Riot Games in 2014/15 for around half a billion dollars - look now at how great that investment has paid off for them.

 

[Deleted member 13]

If you think Sleepy Brown is presenting a differing opinion and not just trolling... I honestly feel sad.

It doesn't matter what his intentions are, we don't do personal attacks.

 

[Vertigo]

Destiny 2 went f2p, several years after being a paid game.

It’s not tho. Requires Ps plus. New expansion and dlc content runs 100$ a year and is not free. This is not Warframe. Destiny’s content has pay walls. Insert change to continue. It’s very much an extensive demo. Battlepass content does not earn you currency for next battle pass. You can’t grind yourself to everything. You gotta pay for content. I mean, it’s quite traditional.

Lightfall at $50 is even more expensive than Witch Queen because that increase reflects the addition of a new dark subclass. Bungie charges players for everything . Like I dunno if it was f2p you wouldn’t need to drop 50$ to play it’s next chapter. The issue is semantics. It gives an incorrect assumption. F2p players are never happy when D2 immediately shows that you need money to get more than a week out of it. What they do is the console friendly version of an mmo sub

Destiny does not make money on MTs. Bungie themselves have stated that their players don’t really engage with it (because in-game bright dust is generous and the stuff sold is who cares). They get continued revenue for expansions and season dlc.

Portions of the game are free, casual playlist activities, some sample content from new expansions and season; an exotic weapon and a handful weapons introduced or reintroduced into world loot pools; there’s much more they do not. It’s something…. But all in all the free game is not supported well at all.

When it went f2p it basically put the first two years of campaigns and raids up for free. Basically everything developed with Activision. That’s gone. Now only thing that’s part of the free game is casual fodder and no end game aside from two 8 year old raids and a free release dungeon (all excellent content - not strikes — who plays strikes. LOL).

They were able to do that because it was old content no one engaged in anymore. There was no more real sales pontential left of reasons for hardcore players to even populate that content

So no I don’t think TLOU can just go be a f2p pvepvp online game out of the gate and just monetize seasons. It’ll launch full retail price. It’s not going to be just pvp with map changes season to season.

The idea that f2p is a successful model is kind of bs. Most games can’t do it.

Microsoft can continue being the vulture that they are. 100 billion spent has been a massive failure thus far. They own IPs but are creatively bankrupt and have a slew of talentless studios incapable of shipping games finished or at all.

Halo Infinite launch couldn’t even outperform D2’s paid for 30th anniversary release. It destroyed Infinite from the day they launched against each other.

The truth is Xbox fans still trust Bungie over Halo. Beyond Light was the game that launched gamespass on series X and carried the service for that entire launch year.

Destiny leaves XBL’s top 10 for like 3 days at the tail end of every 3 months season. Halo can’t hang in the top 20.

MARATHON might be f2p tho. I don’t expect it to be narrative heavy, have campaigns or heavy pve aspects.